QUESTIONS for the team of L5. . . or anyone. . .

Greetings to all . . .

I have a few questions to all and to the L5 team. . . (I just lost my previous composition because of a bug either in explorer or this site)

I have L4 and am planning to upgrade to L5 very soon. In my using L4 I have accumulated over 3600 resources and continuing to purchase more before I retire. . .
I use L4 everyday and read dozens of books at one time, in other words, I sometimes have many books open. Nothing new for a program like this one. . .
However, my wife is considering using L5 (when I get it). She is now doing counseling courses in church. Now I have many layouts designed for my use. My question for L5 team are the following:
1. Does L5 have the capacity of having workspaces for more than one user? (Please don't tell me to add more layouts)
2. Does L5 have the capacity of a database of bookmarks? I sometimes loose my place because even when applying the different suggestions on this forum, they are limited on the way I use my books. I think it would be easier if a database of bookmarks can be seen on the screen so that I can just click on it and see where and what books I am currently reading.
3. Does L5 have the capacity of saving studies (not the way layout has it) where I can have any book(s) share a workspace so that in case I open up a book, I can see what workspace(s) this book contributes to. . . Make sense?
4. Does L5 have a personal printer utility where I can have my own presentations even in Microsoft office within the workspace?
5. Finally, (there are more questions, but for now these are enough), will L5 allow me to have more than one user?
I love the tool and it's a great blessing to have and use. It is a big and time consuming program.
If L5 did not allow for more than one personal user, I am sad that such great software engineers did not think of a family using Logos!
If there is any way that more than one personal user can be applied to Logos 4 or 5 without having to go to school for it, please I am willing to learn. I've been using Logos for 10 years. I am patiently waiting for a multi-user workspaces and interface. . . in Logos Bible Software.
Many blessings. . . God bless.

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa

Find more posts tagged with

Comments

Rich DeRuiter

1. Does L5 have the capacity of having workspaces for more than one user? (Please don't tell me to add more layouts)

No. Logos is designed to be used by one person. You may view the EULA (End User License Agreement) here: http://www.logos.com/ArticleViewer/2090

However, if your wife's use of Logos is incidental (that is she is not using it as a professional), she may create her own layouts and name them in a way that makes sense to her. However, they will be visible to you, and your layouts will be visible to her.

2. Does L5 have the capacity of a database of bookmarks? I sometimes loose my place because even when applying the different suggestions on this forum, they are limited on the way I use my books. I think it would be easier if a database of bookmarks can be seen on the screen so that I can just click on it and see where and what books I am currently reading.

You may want to explore Favorites: http://wiki.logos.com/Favorites, and Bookmarks: http://wiki.logos.com/Bookmarks

3. Does L5 have the capacity of saving studies (not the way layout has it) where I can have any book(s) share a workspace so that in case I open up a book, I can see what workspace(s) this book contributes to. . . Make sense?

If I understand you, no this isn't possible. Logos4/5, unless you attach a note to the resource telling you which layout you have used this resource in.

4. Does L5 have a personal printer utility where I can have my own presentations even in Microsoft office within the workspace?

I'm not sure what you mean by this. But it is not possible to have an MS Office window within Logos4/5. It is possible to export, copy/paste, and print most personal documents to MS Office programs. Your options can be found by clicking on the resource icon (upper left).

5. Finally, (there are more questions, but for now these are enough), will L5 allow me to have more than one user?

See my reply to your first question.

EDIT: Please note that I tried to give succinct answers, rather than complete ones. If you have a specific question or need further clarification, I'd be happy to elaborate.

JT (alabama24)

Does L5 have the capacity of having workspaces for more than one user?

If L5 did not allow for more than one personal user, I am sad that such great software engineers did not think of a family using Logos!

No. Your license is for "one user." Logos has generously interpreted this to include a spouse, if the resources are not being used vocationally. Your children, who are living at home, can also be included in this "one user." It is important to remember that when you "purchase" resources, you don't actually "own" them. You have a license agreement which grants you certain rights & responsibilities. This agreement is agreed upon by you, Logos, and the publisher.

Does L5 have the capacity of a database of bookmarks?

As far as I know, L5 is unchanged in the area of Bookmarks & Favorites. If you are unfamiliar with those, let us know.

As for your other questions… I am a bit confused. If no one else bites, please rephrase and ask again. [:)]

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433250#Comment_433250

Hi Richard,

Thanks very much for your response.
In reference to the one user several workspaces, I have one copy of Office 2010 under my name. However, my wife uses my computer. It is not against the law to have more than one user in one computer at home. I am not saying that I will have more than one computer for different people using L5. It is one computer with L4 or L5 under my name in which my wife can use it also. She even uses my email also. This is what I am trying to communicate.
In using layouts, after having several dozens layouts they become cumbersome and long and in some ways, un-managable. Furthermore, what if I want to have another workspace? One workspace has all studies on Prophecy, another on History, and another on Theology Proper in which layouts, and other resources are available to each workspace.

As for bookmarks, in all respect to all submissions on this forum, I've tried many ways to attempt bookmarks and I have yet to see any of them to work efficiently. I've already seen other interfaces of other programs where bookmarks are very simple in its use and very pratical. Easily stored in front of the viewer. I've used favorites also and they also are a little cumbersome to use. But I use them much in my studies. It does not solve my particular need.

In reference to the next question: I would like to click on any book and see all the studies, and workspaces that this book is attached to. Whether layouts, workspaces(in case they are ever implemented), favorites and so forth. . . In attaching notes, unless the note is open I cannot have access to it. This also becomes cumbersome, I don't mean to be picky, really, but Logos is a big library management system in some cases more than a bible study program.

In accessing other programs Logos does have some access to other programs in Office. By a context menu, I can send information to a Power point presentation, or copy to Word. But what I am (wishing for) is an environment where data is center, not the program!

And finally, the last wish is that from within Logos, (remember data is center, not application) I can have a presentation platform or environment where I can access or choose whatever format I want to present my study; be it in PDF or any other media means. If I want to create a PDF file with all my studies notes, book names, and so forth, I can with one click be able to produce a booklet. I might need to practice your suggestion on this one.

I'm looking for production, efficiency, and in a timely manner the production of a study, book, or research paper. In my humble opinion, Logos does not have these because they concentrate on more of the resources and its power, not the production of a finalized product.
Maybe,

Richard, thank you so much for your input. . . it may be L7 in which it will become a biblical data center research system in which by one look at, one will know how to start. . .

Blessings to you. . .

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa

Philana Crouch

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433270#Comment_433270

In using layouts, after having several dozens layouts they become cumbersome and long and in some ways, un-managable. Furthermore, what if I want to have another workspace? One workspace has all studies on Prophecy, another on History, and another on Theology Proper in which layouts, and other resources are available to each workspace.

Alfredo,

You keep mentioning both Layouts and Workspaces. The problem is that there is only layouts (that is what a workspace would be). You and your wife could each label your layouts (she can add her initials) they can be searched and filtered out.

They can be searched if they end up growing too big of a list.

Blessings,

Philana

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433288#Comment_433288

Hello Philana,

Thank you for your response. I want to be able to access all my layout of different books on the screen from within one workspace. Why?
Because with one workspace I can have many other resources within the grasp of the screen without having to hunt, if you will, for other resources. Make sense?
For example: If I can create a workspace called History. Within the WS, I then open 25 books which defines my research initially. OK, I now have a layout made for me by Logos. Next, I open up a notes for every book open to keep notes on the specific book I want to research. I then set up custom searches with groups of books, groups of bibles I use, and groups of presentations. All these I can have within one WS.

However, with layouts I only have one option: the layout I am working with. With WS, I can have two WS open at the same time with different layouts. Furthermore, I can do a search within all my resources and find where all my WS's are defined for the specific book(s) I am searching. I cannot do this, as far as I understand with the current Logos. So with one book I may have ten WS's defined. Each WS can have a definite plan or if you will a title where it is displayed on the top of the window, like a document name. Right now, this is not the case. It is only my wish for a program that is so large with so many smart people in Logos, I'm sure they should and could come up with some way to manage so large a database as the one I now have to manage with much care. Because if not, I will and have already over filed a layout I did not want to lose, but lost it because I did not see which layout I clicked. Sounds confusing? I'm sorry, not meaning to wordy, but I have a clear picture of I would like to see in Logos interface.

Thank you. . .

Blessings. . .

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa

Philana Crouch

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433301#Comment_433301

Ok I understand what you are saying. Currently we can only have one layout open at a time. I usually just switch layouts when I need to. I can see where having multiple layouts (I'm assuming different windows) would be useful. I would at least recommend that you name your layouts with your initials and her layouts with hers, then you can filter each others out..

Alan Palmer (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433270#Comment_433270

I have one copy of Office 2010 under my name. However, my wife uses my computer. It is not against the law to have more than one user in one computer at home. I am not saying that I will have more than one computer for different people using L5. It is one computer with L4 or L5 under my name in which my wife can use it also.

I'm afraid I won't be of much use to your questions regarding "workspaces" vs "layouts" but I hope I can help clear up some details regarding licensing of Logos and resources.

There is an important distinction here that may at first appear subtle. Purchasing Office 2010 grants the user a license to the software. Logos on the other hand, gives away the software for free and grants the user licenses to the resources.

You should feel free to install Logos on as many computers as you would like (home/work/laptop/etc) and access your resources from all of them using your same account. You just can't share your account with any other users.

However, as mentioned by some of your fellow users, Logos has historically been gracious in the interpretation of the single user to include non-professional use of your account by immediate family members who live with you.

I hope that helps clear up some of the confusion.

Joshua Coady

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433316#Comment_433316

Depending on how your wife is going to use the Logos resources, it may end up being easier for her to just access them via biblia.com or the ipad app, assuming the resources she is interested in is available in those environments. Also, she'd still need to acquire access to them via your account so the prior notes on licensing still apply (unless she only needs access to those resources Logos provides for free).

Keep Smiling 4 Jesus :)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433270#Comment_433270

Logos uses User Voice to gauge community interest for program feature suggestions. Every Logos has 10 votes; up to 3 can be placed on any one feature suggestion. Noted 31 suggestions about layouts, including links for those having 20 or more votes:

http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-5/suggestions/659803-save-update-layout-without-needing-to-remember-its

http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-5/suggestions/639625-provide-option-to-have-logos-open-to-a-disignated-

http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-5/suggestions/1035553-floating-window-layouts

http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-5/suggestions/656235-manual-save-import-export-of-notes-collections-lay

http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-5/suggestions/1528415-additional-layout-customization

Logos forums has Suggestions => http://community.logos.com/forums/28.aspx that has been used to discuss some feature ideas before creating a Logos User Voice suggestion: e.g. => http://community.logos.com/forums/t/60773.aspx that includes a User Voice Suggestion for a History Go Back and Forward in each tab, which has already received 15 votes with a day of the suggestion being created.

Keep Smiling [:)]

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433316#Comment_433316

Alan,

Thank you for your clearing up this situation. Let me give you a scenario: I'm home from work. I go to my PC and Logos is always up and running. I do reading, research, and more. I then tell my wife, "Honey would you please find out what the word 'Law' is the dictionary on Logos. She comes and does the search and stores the search in a layout, adding to the dozens of layouts I now have. Quite a simple scenario, hoping I am not breaking the Talmud law on license!!!

Alan said: ". . . Logos has historically been gracious in the interpretation of the single user to include non-professional use of your account by immediate family members who live with you. . ."

I like to believe that Logos will not create a Legalistic environment of usage when two married people who happens to be one flesh in the same house with the same goals with the same money, one walet and one heart according the Flagship Book which Logos happens to use as the Primary Book in its software, because it's really not about that.

It's really about my wife seeing the wonders of a Bible Software called Logos. And she wanting to use it as "My Wife" who happens to be part owner in my eyes because she has paid for the software also!!! But my name is on it. We have one walet, not two. So. . . in my house Logos belongs to my wife and I. We both paid for it!!! In fact, her name should be on it also and I should speak with Logos in having my wife's name on it with mine. . .

It's also about me wanting to see Workspaces that will apply themselves in a multi-users (oops-wrong: one flesh users) environment. Don't you love it?? :-)

Thank you so much Alan. . .
Blessings. . .

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa oh yes and. . . Alma Roman-Sosa

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433322#Comment_433322

Joshua,

Please read my postings to Alan. . .

Blessings. . .

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433359#Comment_433359

Al – I can appreciate your feelings on the matter, but the simple truth is that you have entered into an agreement with Logos (and the publishers) which grants access to the resources to only one user. Logos isn't going to create the features you are asking for, because there is no reason to do so under the current agreement. The letter of the law doesn't include your spouse... The spirit of the law, as interpreted by Bob (the owner of Logos), does allow for your spouse to use your resource licenses for non-professional uses.

If Logos created a multi-user workspace system as you suggest, what would prevent churches to grant access to their entire staff?

Bradley Grainger (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433359#Comment_433359

I like to believe that Logos will not create a Legalistic environment of usage when two married people who happens to be one flesh in the same house with the same goals with the same money, one walet and one heart according the Flagship Book which Logos happens to use as the Primary Book in its software, because it's really not about that.

Bob has posted the "official" Logos position on this matter before: http://community.logos.com/forums/p/341/3265.aspx#3265

Please read all of Bob's post, but my quick summary for your specific case would be that we see no problem with you and your wife sharing the software in the way you described. However, because you are "one user", you share the same set of layouts, notes documents, highlights, etc.

It's also about me wanting to see Workspaces that will apply themselves in a multi-users (oops-wrong: one flesh users) environment. Don't you love it?? :-)

If you want two sets of workspaces (layouts) & documents, you need to become two users and buy two different libraries.

Joshua Coady

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433364#Comment_433364

Al (..and Alma [:)] ) -- I am not as knowledgeable at Logos at some, but it sounds like the way you are using layouts is not quite the way Logos intended layouts to be used. Obviously, you can use the software in whatever way it allows, but when we venture into using it in ways that werent conceived of by the creators, we sometimes run into places where the usability of the software for that purpose was not fully tested or not tested at all and is not able to do well or at all what we want.

It is my understanding that layouts are intended as a way to save the set of tabs/sections/settings that you have setup to perform a particular task. For your lookup of law example, I think what the intention was is that you have a "word lookup" layout whose purpose is to have the resources at hand most useful to you in looking up info on a particular word. You then use that layout to lookup info on the word you are currently interested in and you re-use that layout every time you want to do that task, regardless of the specific word you are interested in at the time.

In short, it seems to me that layouts are meant to be task-oriented, but not really intended to save the results of any particular application of a task. This probably points out a place where Logos is lacking -- it would be nice to be able to save and organize these things better so they could be more useful.

Currently, I'm not sure of the best way to do what you want. What you are doing with having many saved layouts may be the best way currently to do it. Maybe it'd be better to manually summarize the results into a notes document with references back to the resources that were found most useful on that particular subject. Maybe others have some better ideas that they could share.

Hopefully you can find a reasonable solution that works for you. [8-|]

As for multiple users per account, I dont think Logos will ever do that under their current licensing structure where "one flesh" equals "one user" equals no need for multiple users under the same account.

Erwin Stull, Sr.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433382#Comment_433382

If Logos created a multi-user workspace system as you suggest, what would prevent churches to grant access to their entire staff?

Logos does have the ability and knowledge to create a multi-user or site license model based on seats, however, I believe the cost may be prohibited for the average family. I've seem software (not bible software) offered, and the difference in cost is substantial. And also, since Logos is actually marketing resources that they themselves have not produced from the ground up, there may be a lot of issues involved with publishers, etc. It just becomes a big mess to even think about.

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433382#Comment_433382

I truly understand what you are saying. However, I'm not suggesting in any way to break laws. I want ME to be able to have different WS because this is the way I now use other software. WS is a practical way of keeping orderly resources being used and recorded. I'm not necessarily speaking of two users. It just so happens that I mentioned my wife because we are teaching in church and she has access to my computer. But who can prove she uses it when I'm not? The features I'm asking for does not define more than one user, rather it defines more than one desktop or simply workspace for 'one' user. I believe the current agreement will change in the future because Logos is becoming a very large resource. And truly, when books add up to the thousands, I know that Logos will have to attend on how to manage 1000's of books for one user. It' becoming a challenge to manage 10 or 20 books when opened.

In fact, I truly believe that Logos WILL soon do such thing as this because it will be a practical tool. Besides, I use a tool in my workplace that uses WS and it is licensed for the company, granted, but only one user per computer. Either way, it will come. . . just listen and wait.

You asked me: "If Logos created a multi-user workspace as you suggest (I do not suggest this at all, not my original intent), what would prevent churches to grant access to their staff?"

I have another question to ask: "What would prevent a church to grant access to staff members now under the current layout display?" Both questions have the same answer! Nothing. Both environments does yield a multi-user environment! Just by using Layouts, in as much as they cumbersome to use.

Blessings. . .

Thank you.

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433394#Comment_433394

Joshua,

I agree with you on the point of layouts. I use as much of Logos as I can. The more I use it the more ideas come up as to how to manage many resources. But you know, maybe one day Logos will allow the public interface API to be made available. I would be willing to develop something like this for my own use. I do this now for AutoCAD in my workplace. I designed my own workspace and it works wonderfully.

Thank you.

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433407#Comment_433407

You asked me: "If Logos created a multi-user workspace as you suggest (I do not suggest this at all, not my original intent), what would prevent churches to grant access to their staff?"

But this is exactly what you asked for!

Does L5 have the capacity of having workspaces for more than one user?

I am patiently waiting for a multi-user workspaces and interface. . . in Logos Bible Software.

How can you say that I misunderstood you?

I have another question to ask: "What would prevent a church to grant access to staff members now under the current layout display?" Both questions have the same answer! Nothing. Both environments does yield a multi-user environment! Just by using Layouts, in as much as they cumbersome to use.

Respectfully, many of your complaints are the very reasons that prevent others from sharing an account. Let's suggest for a moment that the licensing agreement allowed me to share my resources with anyone I wanted to… The first time someone marked up one of my resources would be the last time they used my library! The mere fact that Logos syncs all settings, highlights, notes, layouts, etc is a practical deterrent for others to share an account. Just this week I heard from a user who had loaded his library on to another mobile device, only to discover that another user's highlights were appearing in his account! Needless to say, he was working very hard to figure out how to remove the other user. [I'm not sure of this user's circumstances, but I was tempted to load Logos onto an iPad at the Apple Store to see how it looked with the retina display. It would have been very bad if I had done so and left Logos on the device for thousands to play with!]

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433407#Comment_433407

I want ME to be able to have different WS because this is the way I now use other software. WS is a practical way of keeping orderly resources being used and recorded. I'm not necessarily speaking of two users. It just so happens that I mentioned my wife because we are teaching in church and she has access to my computer.

I would like to have Logos provide me with an integrated study environment that paralleled the IDE's I'm use to working with. I can identify the products I would like in my IDE and point out they all use XML formats to ease integration. Unfortunately, the Logos decision makers either:

don't share my view
don't share my prioritization of features
wish to wait for integration technology to improve before providing the integration
believe it would appeal to a small portion of their user base
some idea that doesn't occur to me that is an impediment

The point is that making suggestions on the Suggestion forum, emails to the suggestion department and entries on uservoice are the way to influence Logos to consider your suggestions.

Patrick S.

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433440#Comment_433440

[...] I was tempted to load Logos onto an iPad at the Apple Store to see how it looked with the retina display [...]

It looks good — very readable [H]

JT (alabama24)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433688#Comment_433688

It looks good — very readable

Ahh… but I know that from personal experience now. [:D]

I sold my original 64GB 3G iPad to Amazon, and bought a refurbished 16GB 3rd Gen (retina) iPad. With birthday money and the sale of my original iPad, the refurbished iPad cost me less than $100. It was WELL worth it, and for more than just the retina display.

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433440#Comment_433440

Alabama24. . .

Yes, you're correct. My bad for being inconsistent with my words. I understand the problems with having multi-users in Logos. However, I wanted originally to have my wife and I as users within the environment of workspaces. This is what I was and have been trying to convey. My apologies for not being consistent.

Indeed, I am not complaining, though I am voicing an opinion in which I have basis for expecting it to be done soon. Let me share with you that I love my Logos Application and all the resources therein. Logos is my first app in which I head to after praying. . . So let me clear this up now, I am not complaining. Second, I agree wholeheartedly with you concerning others not having access to my resources. Rightly so. But I am talking about my wife, not another person outside my home. Again, your point is well taken, but I do believe, that Workspaces is a practical idea. I believe that workspaces will work well with only one user also. I use a software package with WS and I am the only one with the license. I can create WS with different drawings. If I create a WS, I can open up all the drawings involved in the WS without having to hunt for them one by one. The WS will do this for me.

In addition, having a portable WS so that I am able to export all my studies will work if the data is made in XML. This is the way data is handled in many apps. Because Logos is so large, it becomes cumbersome until someone in Logos determines to make Logos a data centric app and not a app-centric environment. Everybody else has done this including AutoCAD, MS and others who now intergrate data. This is another topic for discussion, of which I do not desire to initiate, I'm only thinking aloud!!

And finally. . . the word is out. . . Workspaces is in the future for Logos!! I only hope the competitors will not jump in sooner because it is a real easy and friendly user interface experience. Someone will read these lines and will start a movement for Workspaces. They work, I know.

Thank you. . .

God Bless. . .

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433452#Comment_433452

M.J.

I hear you. I thought, (I might not be up to date on these things), XML is already a smooth way for data integration. Something that can make Logos more portable, at least the data produced. Either way, it seems like Logos will not at this time design an integrated study environment. This would be outstanding with workspaces.

Thank you. . .

Eis Cristos

Al Sosa

Richard Lyall

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433253#Comment_433253

No. Your license is for "one user." Logos has generously interpreted this to include a spouse,

Does this include concubines?

Joshua Coady

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433957#Comment_433957

No. Your license is for "one user." Logos has generously interpreted this to include a spouse,

Does this include concubines?

According to the forum guidelines we shouldnt be discussing "controversial topics", so, as it relates to the software ... yes, but only if they live in the same house and dont use Logos professionally.

Richard Lyall

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/433960#Comment_433960

I'm merely applying a reverse hermeneutic (i.e. this is what it means now, what would it have meant back then) to the EULA, as Logos is such an outstanding tool for exploring such issues