We need more books on the Doctrine of Hell

JoshInRI
JoshInRI Member Posts: 1,942 ✭✭✭
edited November 2024 in English Forum

We need more books on the Doctrine of Hell and What Jesus specifically said about it?

I would begin with WHATEVER HAPPENED TO HELL? by John Blanchard.

Why isn't this important book in the Logos collection please?  

p.s. (Yes I know about Chan's book, Erasing Hell, thanks and no I am not interested AT ALL with Rob Bell's sad errant bestseller either).

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Comments

  • DAL
    DAL Member Posts: 10,935 ✭✭✭

    No books on hell because many have become tolerant and only want to present a lovey dovey Jesus who tolerates sin and sinners.  Share your faith, share your love and share the love of Jesus with others and it's all about love and the kindness of God, but many have thrown aside the severity of God (Romans 11:22) and the fact that our God is a consuming fire (Hebrews 12:29) and that it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God (Hebrews 10:31).  Seems like hell offends people and who are you to judge, etc. and therefore many play politics in the church.

    That's what I've observed in many churches now days.  Some might like my comment, some my not, I'm not judging anybody, just stating facts.  And before some start giving me a fit about my comment, for the record: I'm not generalizing! I know there's still a remnant who remains faithful to God and presents His whole counsel like Paul, the great soldier of the Cross, did (Acts 20:26-27).

    I try to be balanced in my preaching, but a lot of the preaching now days lacks Bible and focuses only on the "sweet" side of God which quite honestly, can become "cloying" over time.

    By the way, "Cloying" is a word I looked up on the dictionary to translate my thoughts from Spanish to English, so hopefully the word was used correctly, if not, feel free to correct me ;-)

    Happy Lord's Day!

    DAL

  • Mark Barnes
    Mark Barnes Member Posts: 15,432 ✭✭✭

    I would begin with WHATEVER HAPPENED TO HELL? by John Blanchard.

    That's a good book, and it would be good to see it in Logos (the publisher has several books in Logos now, so perhaps this one will come one day).

    In the meantime, you may like this one: http://www.logos.com/product/26689/hell-under-fire-modern-scholarship-reinvents-eternal-punishment

    I doubt you'll like this one, but it's an important book: http://www.logos.com/product/20263/the-fire-that-consumes-a-biblical-and-historical-study-of-the-doctrine-of-final-punishment-3rd-ed

    This is my personal Faithlife account. On 1 March 2022, I started working for Faithlife, and have a new 'official' user account. Posts on this account shouldn't be taken as official Faithlife views!

  • Donovan R. Palmer
    Donovan R. Palmer Member, MVP Posts: 2,925

    Don't forget the Zondervan Counterpoints 'Four Views of Hell'. Logos has a number of the Counterpoints books, but this one hasn't been released yet.

  • Tommy Miller
    Tommy Miller Member Posts: 56 ✭✭

    "Hell? Yes? (And Other Outrageous Truths You Can Still Believe)" by Robert Jeffress (Water Brook Press) has a wonderful chapter called "God Sends Good People to Hell." It is excellent. D. James Kennedy called the book "...a most provocative work..." It should be in Logos.

    I find it very interesting that "Four Views on Hell" from the Counterpoints Series by Zondervan (William Crockett, Gen. Editor) is not available. At least 21 of the other Counterpoints books are on Logos, but not this one. Why not this topic?  Of course, with the price of Zondervan books on Logos it is definitely cheaper in print! I paid $6.99 for my copy. Counterpoint books are $14-$16 in sets on Logos!  Hey, Logos, can I buy the "paperback" edition?

    Tony Evans preached a really good sermon called: "You Can Go to Hell!" The subtitle put it into perspective: "or You Can Go to Heaven."

    My favorite sermon, however, is from the late Dr. Ken Connolly. In quiet tones of Scottish brogue he spoke simply on the Rich Man in Luke 16. He never raised his voice, he never shed a tear. But I wept for the Rich Man when he was finished.

    Spurgeon mentioned "Hell" 9,860 times in my Logos collection on Spurgeon. He said this: "There are some ministers who never mention anything about hell. I heard of a minister who once said to his congregation, 'If you do not love the Lord Jesus Christ, you will be sent to that place which it is not polite to mention.' He ought not to have been allowed to preach again, I am sure, for he could not use plain words."
    [C. H. Spurgeon, 2,200 Quotations: From the Writings of Charles H. Spurgeon : Arranged Topically or Textually and Indexed by Subject, Scripture, and People, ed. Tom Carter (Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Books, 1995). Exported from Logos Bible Software 5, 3:53 PM May 19, 2013.]

    Spurgeon concluded another sermon this way:
    I have not shunned to preach of hell with all its horrors, until I have been laughed at, as if I always preached upon it. I have not shunned to preach upon the most sweet and pleasing themes of the gospel, till I have feared lest I should make my preaching effeminate, instead of retaining the masculine vigour of a Boanerges. I have not shunned to preach the law; that great commandment has wrung in your ears, “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God, and thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.” I have never feared the great, nor have I courted their smile; I have rebuked nobility as I would rebuke the peasantry, and to everyone of you I have dealt a portion of meat in due season. I know that this much can be said of me—“Here stands one that never feared the face of man yet;” and I hope never will. Amidst contumely, and rebuke, and reproach, I have sought to be faithful to you and to my God. If then, you will be damned, let me have this one thing as a consolation for your misery, when I shall think of so frightful a thought—that you are not damned for the want of calling after; you are not lost for the want of weeping after, and not lost, let me add, for the want of praying after. In the name of him who shall judge the quick and dead according to my Gospel, and of him that shall come in the clouds of heaven, and by that fearful say when the pillars of this earth shall totter, and the heavens shall fall about your ears—by that day when “Depart, ye cursed,” or “Come, ye blessed,” must be the dread alternative, I charge you, lay these things to heart, and as I shall face my God to account for my honesty to you, and my faithfulness to him, so remember, you must stand before his bar, to give an account of how you heard, and how you acted after hearing; and woe unto you if, having been lifted up like Capernaum with privileges, you should be cast down like Sodom and Gomorrah, or lower still than they, because you repented not.
    Oh! Master! turn sinners to thyself; for Jesus sake! Amen.

    [C. H. Spurgeon, The New Park Street Pulpit Sermons, Vol. IV (London; Glasgow: Passmore & Alabaster; James Paul; George John Stevenson; George Gallie, 1858). Exported from Logos Bible Software 5, 4:14 PM May 19, 2013.]

    Charles Spurgeon and Jesus Christ both had great results from preaching on Hell!

    Core i7-2630QM CPU 2.00 GHz, 8 GB RAM, 64-Bit Windows 7 Professional SP1

  • MJ. Smith
    MJ. Smith MVP Posts: 55,475

    If you guys would cut the negative junk out of the above posts and simply ask for / give reasonable suggestions, I would respond with the following list of possibilities.

    • Christ the Conqueror of Hell: The Descent into Hades from an Orthodox Perspective by Archbishop Hilarion Alfeyev
    • Two Views of Hell: A Biblical & Theological Dialogue (Spectrum) by Edward William Fudge and Robert A. Peterson
    • The Nature of Heaven and Hell According to the Holy Fathers by Lazar Puhalo
    • Seeds of Heaven and Hell in the Heart: An Orthodox Perspective on Passions, Virtues, and Life After Death by Igumen Sergius Bowyer
    • Her Gates Will Never Be Shut: Hell, Hope, and the New Jerusalem by Bradley Jersak
    • Death and Afterlife: A Theological Introduction by Terence Nichols

    I think the list is a reasonable list of contemporary work on the topic. They cover a range of views and respect tradition.

    Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."

  • Bruce Dunning
    Bruce Dunning MVP Posts: 11,163

    MJ. Smith said:

    If you guys would cut the negative junk out of the above posts and simply ask for / give reasonable suggestions

    My observations is that most are not able to simply comment or suggest without showing their personal opinions on the matter and that often can come across as negative. We all must be careful to present our opinions/convictions in a way that is positive. Thanks for the reminder.

    Using adventure and community to challenge young people to continually say "yes" to God

  • Deacon Steve
    Deacon Steve Member Posts: 1,608 ✭✭✭
  • JoshInRI
    JoshInRI Member Posts: 1,942 ✭✭✭

    Thanks everyone for the suggestions.  [:)]

    I might be missing something but I dont see any negative replies.

    Maybe they were deleted already. I probably should have requested Protestant Evangelical (non-reformed) books on Hell.

  • Eric Weiss
    Eric Weiss Member Posts: 948 ✭✭✭

    "Hell? Yes? (And Other Outrageous Truths You Can Still Believe)" by Robert Jeffress (Water Brook Press) has a wonderful chapter called "God Sends Good People to Hell." It is excellent. D. James Kennedy called the book "...a most provocative work..." It should be in Logos.

    Robert Jeffress (pastor, FBC Dallas) and D. James Kennedy?

    Top scholars on the subject, I'm sure. [:#]

    Meanwhile, here's an interesting book worth reading and having in Logos: The Formation of Hell: Death and Retribution in the Ancient and Early Christian Worlds

    Optimistically Egalitarian (Galatians 3:28)

  • JoshInRI
    JoshInRI Member Posts: 1,942 ✭✭✭

    Its me Joshua the poster for this thread.....

    i am preaching on What Jesus said about Hell and Why it Still Matters.

    The title may give everyone an idea where I am headed "Their Worm Does Not Die"

  • Brandon Rappuhn
    Brandon Rappuhn Member Posts: 113 ✭✭

    I'm not sure if it's been mentioned, but Hell Under Fire is a pretty good book on the topic, with a good perspective of opinions. I read a few essays from it a few years ago. Has anyone else read it?

    https://www.logos.com/product/26689/hell-under-fire-modern-scholarship-reinvents-eternal-punishment

  • Graham Criddle
    Graham Criddle MVP Posts: 33,286

    HI Brandon

    I'm not sure if it's been mentioned, but Hell Under Fire is a pretty good book on the topic, with a good perspective of opinions

    I agree it is an interesting book (Mark Barnes referenced it in a post above as well) and that it does present a good range of opinions - while arguing for a particular position and understanding.

    Well worth reading

    Graham

  • Brandon Rappuhn
    Brandon Rappuhn Member Posts: 113 ✭✭

    Its me Joshua the poster for this thread.....

    i am preaching on What Jesus said about Hell and Why it Still Matters.

    The title may give everyone an idea where I am headed "Their Worm Does Not Die"

    The third essay in Hell under Fire specifically deals with Jesus' teachings on Hell, however, the writer (Robert W. Yarbrough) comes at it from a strongly anti-Jesus Seminar angle, rather than a general teachings-of-Jesus perspective. It's probably not what you're looking for for the purpose of your sermon. Chapter 10, written by Sinclair Ferguson, gives a pastoral theology on preaching and the subject of Hell. It might be more useful to you since it's a look at biblical theology on the matter.

    Good luck!

  • Matthew C Jones
    Matthew C Jones Member Posts: 10,295 ✭✭✭

    Robert Jeffress (pastor, FBC Dallas) and D. James Kennedy? Top scholars on the subject, I'm sure. Zip it!

    Meanwhile, here's an interesting book worth reading and having in Logos: The Formation of Hell: Death and Retribution in the Ancient and Early Christian Worlds

    = "My scholar can beat up your scholar."    Seriously, I would rather hear from the Ancient of Days than some modern sociologist. 

    Logos 7 Collectors Edition

  • tom
    tom Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭

    MJ. Smith said:

    If you guys would cut the negative junk out of the above posts and simply ask for / give reasonable suggestions

    My observations is that most are not able to simply comment or suggest without showing their personal opinions on the matter and that often can come across as negative. We all must be careful to present our opinions/convictions in a way that is positive. Thanks for the reminder.

    [Y]
  • Sogol
    Sogol Member Posts: 255 ✭✭

    One important Catholic work I'd like to see in Logos is Hans Urs von Balthasar's "Dare We Hope That All Men Be Saved? With a Short Discourse on Hell" (if my memory serves me correctly, I believe that then Cardinal Ratzinger was critical of it).

    http://www.amazon.com/Dare-Hope-Saved-Short-Discourse/dp/0898702070

    From an Orthodox perspective, there is always Bishop Kallistos Ware's "The Inner Kingdom: Volume 1 of the Collected Works" which includes a similarly titled essay "Dare We Hope For the Salvation of All?: Origen, St. Gregory of Nyssa and St Isacc the Syrian." Granted, this may be oriented more towards the question of universalism, but it nevertheless hits a bit on the topic of hell.

    http://www.amazon.com/Inner-Kingdom-Collected-Works/dp/0881412090

  • NB.Mick
    NB.Mick MVP Posts: 16,322

    MJ. Smith said:

    • Death and Afterlife: A Theological Introduction by Terence Nichols

    This is in Vyrso, btw.

    Have joy in the Lord! Smile

  • MJ. Smith
    MJ. Smith MVP Posts: 55,475

    Thanks NB - I rarely check Vyrso except for patristic titles

    Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."

  • Milford Charles Murray
    Milford Charles Murray Member Posts: 5,004 ✭✭✭

    NB.Mick said:

    MJ. Smith said:

    • Death and Afterlife: A Theological Introduction by Terence Nichols

    This is in Vyrso, btw.

    An absolutely lovely and helpful book that I very much appreciated!              *smile*

    Psalm 29:11

    Philippians 4:  4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, Rejoice. 5 Let your reasonableness be known to everyone. The Lord is at hand..........

  • MJ. Smith
    MJ. Smith MVP Posts: 55,475

    You know you need more time when you check the book out on Vyrso only to discover you already own it. More time is obviously a better solution than less resources.[:D]

    Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."

  • papa_gowgow
    papa_gowgow Member Posts: 72 ✭✭

    MJ. Smith said:

    You know you need more time when you check the book out on Vyrso only to discover you already own it. More time is obviously a better solution than less resources.Big Smile

    It was a freebie in June last year.  God bless Logos & Vyrso for their charitable deeds [H]

  • JoshInRI
    JoshInRI Member Posts: 1,942 ✭✭✭

    Mark thanks for this suggestion.  I bought the book but will only use the chapter you recommended for the reasons you suggested.  I think the Jesus Seminar people need prayer (enough said).

  • Mitchell
    Mitchell Member Posts: 454 ✭✭

    For the sake of balance (and having my own views represented), I'll suggest the following:

    Rob Bell's "Love Wins" would probably be a reasonable addition, at least to Vyrso, due to its popularity. Bell isn't a universalist, and the type of universalism he leaves open in his book is (IMHO) too heavily tied to the typically thin American definition of free will, but it's gotten a lot of conversations going.

  • tom
    tom Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭

    Mitchell said:

    For the sake of balance (and having my own views represented), I'll suggest the following:

    Rob Bell's "Love Wins" would probably be a reasonable addition, at least to Vyrso, due to its popularity. Bell isn't a universalist, and the type of universalism he leaves open in his book is (IMHO) too heavily tied to the typically thin American definition of free will, but it's gotten a lot of conversations going.

    [Y]
  • Ken McGuire
    Ken McGuire Member Posts: 2,075 ✭✭✭

    The Gospel is not ... a "new law," on the contrary, ... a "new life." - William Julius Mann

    L8 Anglican, Lutheran and Orthodox Silver, Reformed Starter, Academic Essentials

    L7 Lutheran Gold, Anglican Bronze

  • JoshInRI
    JoshInRI Member Posts: 1,942 ✭✭✭

    Mitchell thanks for your humorous reply. I read Francis Chan instead. 
    I am interested in having Christ's views represented in my sermon.

  • Mitchell
    Mitchell Member Posts: 454 ✭✭

    Mitchell thanks for your humorous reply. I read Francis Chan instead. 
    I am interested in having Christ's views represented in my sermon.

    It sounds like you read the book whose conclusion you already agree with. I wonder, are you truly seeking Christ's views, or merely looking to bolster your own?

    This is not the time nor place to dive into this debate, but my views are 1) rooted in Scripture, which I believe to be the final rule of faith and practice and 2) consistent with historic orthodoxy as attested by the creeds, confession, and church fathers. I'm not absolutely committed to the universalist position, but it seems to require less hermeneutical gymnastics than the alternatives (Calvinism and Arminianism, primarily). I'm always open to a respectful discussion, so if you're interested in talking more please let me know and I'll get you my contact info. I mean this quite sincerely, I would love to hear you out on this if you're up for a civil conversation.

    EDIT: Just to avoid confusion, I do believe hell exists, I just don't exclude the possibility (probability even, given the repeated promises of God's total victory) that it will, in the very long term, be empty due to sinners repenting and turning to Christ. If I thought there was no hell at all, your accusation of ignoring Christ's teaching would be entirely appropriate, but a quick reading of any of the book I mentioned would assure you that Evangelical Universalists believe no such thing.

  • tom
    tom Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭

    Mitchell said:

    it seems to require less hermeneutical gymnastics than the alternatives

    [Y]
  • David Matthew
    David Matthew Member Posts: 169 ✭✭
  • JoshInRI
    JoshInRI Member Posts: 1,942 ✭✭✭

    Mitchell,

    (lifting what Jesus said from my sermon below). 

    Respectfully, What if you are dead wrong, Sir?  Can you live with what I've underlined below?

    Let’s look at verse 15 first (I underlined for emphasis):

    Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves. [1]

    Skip down to verse 29

    29       “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous,

    30       and say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.’

    31       “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets.

    32       Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt.

    33       Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell? [2]

    Mitchell, would you actually argue with God?  I would hate to think of you (and those you convince, lead, or teach) in Hell where your/their worm would not die, where you would rot forever and be separated from God forever.

    Are you gnashing your teeth at God, Mitchell? 




    [1] The New King James Version (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, 1982), Mt 23:15.


    [2] The New King James Version (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, 1982), Mt 23:29–33.


  • Rosie Perera
    Rosie Perera Member Posts: 26,194 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Mitchell probably could teach us all a thing or two about Hell because he has the letters "H-E-L-L" (in that order, with no intervening letters) in his name. [:)]

    This posts means nothing at all; I just love word play.

  • MJ. Smith
    MJ. Smith MVP Posts: 55,475

    Are you gnashing your teeth at God, Mitchell? 

    Joshua, I believe you have crossed the line and are now trying to push your theology rather than asking for assistance with Logos. Please remind yourself of the guidelines of the forum and abide by them.

    Please abide by the following guidelines as you interact on our forums.

    1. Please keep your discussions focused on Logos Bible Software: our software, products, websites, company, tools, etc.
    2. Please do not discuss or debate biblical, theological, or other controversial topics. Use one of the many web forums intended for these kinds of discussions. ...

    Admittedly this is not the first post in the thread to cross the line but  ....

    Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."

  • Mike Pettit
    Mike Pettit Member Posts: 1,041 ✭✭

    Let this then be our sacred rule, to seek to know nothing concerning it, except what Scripture teaches us: when the Lord closes his holy mouth, let us also stop the way, that we may not go farther. 

    Calvin, J., & Owen, J. (2010). Commentary on the Epistle of Paul the Apostle to the Romans (354). Bellingham, WA: Logos Bible Software.

  • Giovanni Baggio
    Giovanni Baggio Member Posts: 250 ✭✭

    We need more books on the Doctrine of Hell and What Jesus specifically said about it?

    I would begin with WHATEVER HAPPENED TO HELL? by John Blanchard.

    Why isn't this important book in the Logos collection please?  

    p.s. (Yes I know about Chan's book, Erasing Hell, thanks and no I am not interested AT ALL with Rob Bell's sad errant bestseller either).

    You make me laugh dude, isn't the Bible enough for you to read about hell and what Jesus said about it? Go read it and you might just get what you're looking for it's been there for a little over 2K years [A]   aaaah and by the way the Bible is available in Logos and is more important than any other book collection you can get [;)] so important that even Satan thinks it's good to quote it [6] 

    blessings my little children!

    Giovanni

  • Sogol
    Sogol Member Posts: 255 ✭✭

    You make me laugh dude, isn't the Bible enough for you to read about hell and what Jesus said about it? Go read it and you might just get what you're looking for it's been there for a little over 2K years Angel   aaaah and by the way the Bible is available in Logos and is more important than any other book collection you can get Wink so important that even Satan thinks it's good to quote it Devil 

    blessings my little children!

    Giovanni

    Great point. My entire Logos collection, excluding Bibles, is now up for sale.

  • Sogol
    Sogol Member Posts: 255 ✭✭
  • Deacon Steve
    Deacon Steve Member Posts: 1,608 ✭✭✭

    You make me laugh dude, isn't the Bible enough for you ...

     

    I frequently fall short, and at the risk of steering off coarse a little, I always appreciate (and need) instruction ... ACTS 8:26ff

     

  • Mitchell
    Mitchell Member Posts: 454 ✭✭

    Mitchell,

    (lifting what Jesus said from my sermon below). 

    Respectfully, What if you are dead wrong, Sir?  Can you live with what I've underlined below?

    Let’s look at verse 15 first (I underlined for emphasis):

    Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves. [1]

    Skip down to verse 29

    29       “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous,

    30       and say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.’

    31       “Therefore you are witnesses against yourselves that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets.

    32       Fill up, then, the measure of your fathers’ guilt.

    33       Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell? [2]

    Mitchell, would you actually argue with God?  I would hate to think of you (and those you convince, lead, or teach) in Hell where your/their worm would not die, where you would rot forever and be separated from God forever.

    Are you gnashing your teeth at God, Mitchell? 


    [1] The New King James Version (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, 1982), Mt 23:15.

    [2] The New King James Version (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, 1982), Mt 23:29–33.

    I certainly hope I'm not gnashing my teeth at God. My intention is only to interpret Scripture faithfully, including but not limited to the parts you quoted. Again, I do believe in hell, and take it quite seriously, but I think our doctrine of its nature and longevity (neither of which are addressed in the verses you cited) must be interpreted consistently with the promises given in the rest of Scripture.

    I would love to respond more specifically, but as others have pointed out we've already passed the boundaries of this forum's purpose. If you're interested in continuing the conversation, send me an email at spamofmitch at gmail dot com (I'll give you my regular email address, but I don't want the spam that comes with putting it on a forum).

  • JoshInRI
    JoshInRI Member Posts: 1,942 ✭✭✭

    I mean this sincerely and not offhandedly....God bless you Mitchell. 

    I appreciated everyone's thoughtful suggestions in here and the interaction helped me utilize Logos 5.0 to inform my sermon (it was a cinch to find the passages in the Gospels with it - logos4:Search;kind=Bible;q=Hell;match=stem) which went reasonably well.  Its only my second sermon and was "topical" but I hope to revisit this subject and do an expositional sermon focused upon one passage in the future instead. 

    I enjoyed using Logos to locate what Jesus said and intended.  Logos use shows us quickly Our Lord did speak on this important topic. I am glad this thread will exist for me/others to return to listing Logos resources for future study and sermons. 

    Glory to God.  Jesus Lead On.[:)]

  • Edwin Bowden
    Edwin Bowden Member Posts: 1,363 ✭✭✭

    We need more books on the Doctrine of Hell and What Jesus specifically said about it?

    Let me preface the following statement with the fact that I strongly believe in a literal hell. I also believe that some emphasize it more than the apostles did.

    If you do a Bible search for "hell" in the book of Acts and Paul's Epistles, you will not find the word used at all.

    Ask yourself, if we do not find "hell" used in Paul's writing and the recorded messages in Acts, how much was it emphasized in the NT church? 

  • Evan Boardman
    Evan Boardman Member Posts: 738 ✭✭

    The people back then believed in hell, there was no need to teach the doctrine. But how to escape it did need teaching.

  • Deacon Steve
    Deacon Steve Member Posts: 1,608 ✭✭✭

    We need more books on the Doctrine of Hell and What Jesus specifically said about it?

    Let me preface the following statement with the fact that I strongly believe in a literal hell. I also believe that some emphasize it more than the apostles did.

    If you do a Bible search for "hell" in the book of Acts and Paul's Epistles, you will not find the word used at all.

    Ask yourself, if we do not find "hell" used in Paul's writing and the recorded messages in Acts, how much was it emphasized in the NT church? 

    Interesting subject and comment.  I'll take your word for it that Paul never ever talk about "hell".  Does he talk about life after death?  Or what happens after death?  Or Sheol?  Or anything related?  How do I use Logos to do the research?

     

  • Mitchell
    Mitchell Member Posts: 454 ✭✭

    I mean this sincerely and not offhandedly....God bless you Mitchell. 

    Thank you Joshua. You as well.

  • Milford Charles Murray
    Milford Charles Murray Member Posts: 5,004 ✭✭✭

    Steve said:

    We need more books on the Doctrine of Hell and What Jesus specifically said about it?

    Let me preface the following statement with the fact that I strongly believe in a literal hell. I also believe that some emphasize it more than the apostles did.

    If you do a Bible search for "hell" in the book of Acts and Paul's Epistles, you will not find the word used at all.

    Ask yourself, if we do not find "hell" used in Paul's writing and the recorded messages in Acts, how much was it emphasized in the NT church? 

    Interesting subject and comment.  I'll take your word for it that Paul never ever talk about "hell".  Does he talk about life after death?  Or what happens after death?  Or Sheol?  Or anything related?  How do I use Logos to do the research?

     

    Peace, Steve!        *smile*

               I for one appreciate the wonderful and unique way that St. Paul talks about life and death in his writings!         A lot!     Very special.

    I'm going to have to think about how to use Logos to do the research ...         *smile*                  Most of my knowledge and understanding of Paul's preaching comes from my mind and heart after years and years of reading The Holy Word!             

    For example:

    To Live Is Christ

    Yes, and I will rejoice, 19 for I know that fthrough your prayers and gthe help of hthe Spirit of Jesus Christ this will turn out for my deliverance, 20 as it is my eager expectation and hope ithat I will not be at all ashamed, but that with full jcourage now as always Christ kwill be honored in my body, lwhether by life or by death. 21 For to me mto live is Christ, and to die is gain. 22 If I am to live in the flesh, that means fruitful labor for me. Yet which I shall choose I cannot tell. 23 nI am hard pressed between the two. My desire is oto depart and pbe with Christ, for that is far better

     ....   and here's another lovely one (There are many, many passages from Paul about life and death!)

    37 No, in all these things we are more than yconquerors through zhim who loved us. 38 For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

    Philippians 4:  4 Rejoice in the Lord always; again I will say, Rejoice. 5 Let your reasonableness be known to everyone. The Lord is at hand..........

  • Deacon Steve
    Deacon Steve Member Posts: 1,608 ✭✭✭

    Thanks Milford.  [:)]

    I guess I'm lost on Edwin's comment.

    Ask yourself, if we do not find "hell" used in Paul's writing and the recorded messages in Acts, how much was it emphasized in the NT church? 

  • George Somsel
    George Somsel Member Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭

    Why are you so interested in Hell?  Are you planning a trip?  [:)]

    I understand that it operates on the Raid Roach Motel principle (the bug killer)—you can check in, but you can't check out. [;)]

    george
    gfsomsel

    יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

  • tom
    tom Member Posts: 3,213 ✭✭✭

    I understand that it operates on the Raid Roach Motel principle (the bug killer)—you can check in, but you can't check out. Wink

    hmmm, I understood that it operated like "Hotel California" where "You can check-out any time you like, But you can never leave!" [;)]

  • George Somsel
    George Somsel Member Posts: 10,150 ✭✭✭

    tom said:

    I understand that it operates on the Raid Roach Motel principle (the bug killer)—you can check in, but you can't check out. Wink

    hmmm, I understood that it operated like "Hotel California" where "You can check-out any time you like, But you can never leave!" Wink

    Same principle.

    george
    gfsomsel

    יְמֵי־שְׁנוֹתֵינוּ בָהֶם שִׁבְעִים שָׁנָה וְאִם בִּגְבוּרֹת שְׁמוֹנִים שָׁנָה וְרָהְבָּם עָמָל וָאָוֶן

  • Rosie Perera
    Rosie Perera Member Posts: 26,194 ✭✭✭✭✭

    tom said:

    I understand that it operates on the Raid Roach Motel principle (the bug killer)—you can check in, but you can't check out. Wink

    hmmm, I understood that it operated like "Hotel California" where "You can check-out any time you like, But you can never leave!" Wink

    Same principle.

    Not quite. Your version is missing the pun: "check out" is a euphemism for "die."