A question for priests/pastors or church administrators

Would having the ability to create bulletins (i.e. pull together all your liturgical sources, such as collects, hymns, etc., in one document for printing and distribution at worship services) be a valuable tool in Logos? If so, how much?

I'd love to hear any thoughts anyone (clergy or lay) has about this or related ideas.

(note: I'm making no promises about potential features in Logos. I'm just trying to get feedback on how valuable it would be for me to push for particular features Wink )

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Comments

Ken McGuire

Um - Rite Stuff? Of course, not all Anglicans are ECUSA, but why re-invent the wheel?

But then again, I am a LCMS Lutheran, and not creating bulletins at this time either (although I have done so in the past).

SDG

Ken McGuire

Eleanor Emmott

I'm not Anglican, but I think it would be helpful

mike

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/496294#Comment_496294

oh man... do you know how much we could save in bulletin-paper-printing?? ALOT

If we could move our Sunday church bulletin into digital and into our phone.... that would be awesome. Our young adult would love it, because sometimes we forget whats written in bulletin once we go home after church.

plus our church is small (<200), so we need to save as much as we can to buy our own building.

If I have permission, i'll upload an example of our church's bulletin.

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/496307#Comment_496307

oh man... do you know how much we could save in bulletin-paper-printing?? ALOT

If we could move our Sunday church bulletin into digital and into our phone.... that would be awesome. Our young adult would love it, because sometimes we forget whats written in bulletin once we go home after church.

plus our church is small (<200), so we need to save as much as we can to buy our own building.

Thanks for the feedback, Mike! I really appreciate it [:D]

If I have permission, i'll upload an example of our church's bulletin.

That would be great! [Y]

Lynden O. Williams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/496316#Comment_496316

Not Anglican Ben, but is that not the purpose of handouts? Just make it available so that it can be downloaded as a pdf file.

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/496321#Comment_496321

Not Anglican Ben, but is that not the purpose of handouts? Just make it available so that it can be downloaded as a pdf file.

A lot of the benefit would be in creating the handouts. You often have to pull from a number of different sources (BCP, lectionary, hymnal, etc.), rather than cutting and pasting (literally or figuratively), the function I'm talking about would allow you to pull them all together and then export them to Word or a PDF (or something else). Also, I would think we could potentially integrate it with Proclaim.

Again, this is still in the very early planning stages, but fleshing out these questions will help me when it comes time to trying to get some of these features added, so thanks! [:D]

Kevin Maples

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/496324#Comment_496324

I have a secretary that handles the bulletin as I expect all but the smaller churches do. So I wouldn't use this feature.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/496419#Comment_496419

Not Anglican, not priest, pastor or church administrator. However, as a former coordinator of lay liturgical ministers, I would love the feature to prepare lectors/liturgical readers. However, it must have links to resources such as:

David Wilson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/496423#Comment_496423

Would be useful to be able to put together Liturgical Services in Proclaim more easily (some of the ideas re bulletins would work there too).

A key improvement would be to have the ability to share a given Liturgy presentation with other churches so that we do not have to develop each one independently.

Linking each liturgy to the Lectionary for each week would be a big help.

Also needed is any easy way to lay out Psalms so that we can have them said/sung responsively by full verse of half verse by having the lines in different font color on each slide.

Rosie Perera

Yes, this would be useful, however we also usually have additional stuff in our bulletins (e.g., announcements), so it would have to allow for adding custom extra stuff.

And again, why limit this to just Anglicans? We're a Mennonite congregation and yet we might be able to use something like this.

Room4more

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497511#Comment_497511

[...]

And again, why limit this to just Anglicans? We're a Mennonite congregation and yet we might be able to use something like this.

I would have to agree w/rosie here, the line of questioning seems rather filled with a mouthful of bias......I would like to read his answer....I am wondering if his personal opinion is that the Anglicans would be the only group to benefit from this)?(

R4m.

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497511#Comment_497511

however we also usually have additional stuff in our bulletins (e.g., announcements), so it would have to allow for adding custom extra stuff.

Yeah, I guess it would need to be flexible to allow for stuff like that.

And again, why limit this to just Anglicans? We're a Mennonite congregation and yet we might be able to use something like this.

Definitely! It would be able to be used by anyone who had a need. I'm just trying to use this particular forum to get a sense of the Anglican audience as we look at putting together an Anglican base package. I'm not trying to exclude anyone AT ALL [:D]

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497557#Comment_497557

Just a disclaimer here before this goes any further: I'm not insinuating that Anglicans are the only people who could or should be able to use a feature like this. As I am the Anglican product manager, and this is the Anglican product forum, I'm just trying to get a sense of the Anglican audience.

I would be overjoyed if this was a feature everyone could use. The more potential users, the better the chance that the feature would be added. If you would like to see this feature added, please make some noise all over the forums!

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497560#Comment_497560

Try not to forget us up north too… We have our own Book of Alternative Services and Supplemental Eucharist's from 1998.

-Dan

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497563#Comment_497563

Try not to forget us up north too… We have our own Book of Alternative Services and Supplemental Eucharist's from 1998.

Thanks, Dan. I'm working on getting the BAS. [:D] I'm having trouble placing the Supplemental Eucharists you're referring to. Was that an update to the BAS? I have a feeling I do know what it is but its just slipping my mind at the moment. If you could send me a link to some info I would be grateful.

I've been trying to create a list of prayer books from all the various provinces. So if you (or anyone else) has info on prayer books or other liturgical sources that aren't included in The Book of Common Prayer Collection, I would really appreciate you letting me know.

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497564#Comment_497564

I've been trying to create a list of prayer books from all the various provinces. So if you (or anyone else) has info on prayer books or other liturgical sources that aren't included in The Book of Common Prayer Collection, I would really appreciate you letting me know

I'm sure that MJ will be able to give you all the info you may want on this topic (plus more) - speaking of topics, you may wish to look into the existing Reading Lists by searching http://topics.logos.com/search.aspx?q=liturgy and such.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497564#Comment_497564

The Oxford Guide to the Book of Common Prayer: A Worldwide Survey by Charles Hefling and Cynthia Shattuck should give you the BCPs.

An Anglican Liturgical Library http://www.oremus.org/liturgy/ will give you a big chunk of liturgical books but not the breviaries of the various Anglican orders.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497571#Comment_497571

http://anglicansonline.org/resources/liturgical.html gives a full Anglican Breviary and perhaps some other Liturgy of the Hours; it also has a section on the Anglican use of prayer beads.

Book of Worship: Anglican Use Catholic is the Anglican rite of the Catholic Church.

The Joint Liturgy Group in the UK developed some interesting lectionaries including a 4-year one ... their work would be nice to have in Logos.

The Sarum Missal is available in English and Latin http://justus.anglican.org/resources/bcp/Sarum/

Numerous older resources are given at http://www.allmercifulsavior.com/Liturgy/Liturgics.html

That should keep you busy this upcoming week ... let me know when you run out of titles to track down.

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497573#Comment_497573

The Very Pure Word of God: The Book of Common Prayer as a Model of Biblical Liturgy by Peter Adam, Mark Burkill and Gerald L Bray
Sacramental Life: Spiritual Formation Through the Book of Common Prayer by David A. deSilva
Opening the Prayer Book (New Church's Teaching Series) by Jeffrey Lee
Commentary on the American Prayer Book by Marion J. Hatchett
The Prayer Book Guide to Christian Education: Revised Common Lectionary by Sharon Ely Pearson and Robyn Szoke
The Oxford Guide to the Book of Common Prayer: A Worldwide Survey by Charles Hefling and Cynthia Shattuck

These are among the better supporting materials that ought to be in Logos. I should admit that 75% of my "Episcopal" friends self-identify as Anglo-Catholic so my judgment may be slightly slanted (not to mention that I'm Catholic).

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497564#Comment_497564

http://www.anglican.ca/resources/liturgicaltextsonline/

Supplementary Eucharistic Prayers, Services of the Word, and Night Prayer is the most substantial addition to the BAS. Authorized by General Synod in 2001, it contains additional rites for Sunday services.

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497564#Comment_497564

I have a feeling I do know what it is but its just slipping my mind at the moment. If you could send me a link to some info I would be grateful.

Forgot to quote you but this is what I meant.. Note 1998 was when they were initially released, not completely approved church wide till 2001. I am not aware of any changes made in the 1998 texts but I would of course expect the the house approved 2001 version not the 1998 version.

-Dan

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497573#Comment_497573

The Sarum Missal is available in English and Latin http://justus.anglican.org/resources/bcp/Sarum/

Thanks so much for this list. I'll interact with it more later as things come up. I just wanted to let you know I've got the Sarum Missal in the queue. At this point I've just done the English as I don't want it to be stuck in CP for ages. Do you have a sense how popular the original Latin text is?

MJ. Smith

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/498014#Comment_498014

Do you have a sense how popular the original Latin text is?

Not among Logos users. Among the liturgists, the ability to compare it to other liturgies makes Latin preferable.

You did notice that the Oxford Guide... reference has a list of all the approved comtemporary BCPs? The New Zealand one being the most important, of course, for its psalter.[;)]

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/497753#Comment_497753

http://www.anglican.ca/resources/liturgicaltextsonline/

Supplementary Eucharistic Prayers, Services of the Word, and Night Prayer is the most substantial addition to the BAS. Authorized by General Synod in 2001, it contains additional rites for Sunday services.

Thanks Dan,[Y] this is very helpful. [:D]

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/498085#Comment_498085

MJ, are you sure your degree was in Buddhist studies and not Liturgy?[:P]

David Wilson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/498103#Comment_498103

http://www.anglican.ca/resources/liturgicaltextsonline/

Supplementary Eucharistic Prayers, Services of the Word, and Night Prayer is the most substantial addition to the BAS. Authorized by General Synod in 2001, it contains additional rites for Sunday services.

Thanks Dan, this is very helpful.

Could these (and similar) be formulated in such a way as to make them easy to import into and use with Proclaim ?

David Wilson

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/498129#Comment_498129

http://montreal.anglican.ca/en/Pray/Liturgy/Liturgical-Resources

and to expand Logos resources available in French:

http://www.anglican.ca/resources/liturgicaltextsonline/french/

Le baptême / Holy Baptism
La sainte eucharistie / Holy Eucharist
Le mariage dans le cadre d’une eucharistie / Marriage with the Holy Eucharist
Les funérailles Première forme / Funeral Liturgy Form 1

Prières universelles / litanies
Le propre de l’année / the Proper of the Church Year
L’ordination d’un évêque ou une évêque / The ordination of a bishop
L’ordination des prêtres / The ordination of a priest
L’ordination des diacres / The ordination of a deacon
Le service de la Parole II / A Service of the Word (from Eucharistic Prayers, Services of the Word, and Night Prayer)

Lynden O. Williams

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/498130#Comment_498130

Have little interest in these resources, but I am pleased with the variety that is coming forward, and having forums for the different faith groups, makes it easier to keep track of.

Keep up the good work.

David Ames

hymns, etc.

Then, after the Handout tool [or what ever the Bulletin tool is called] is updated we will then have to add ALL of the Hymn books so that the tool will have something to pull into the Bulletin. Then the Bulletin can be exported to Proclaim and run the entire service! [And if we have the sermon add in it can do the preaching [text to speech?] - and the pastors can then get all their work done during the normal work days and relax and worship on the Lord's day]

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/498213#Comment_498213

Then, after the Handout tool [or what ever the Bulletin tool is called] is updated we will then have to add ALL of the Hymn books so that the tool will have something to pull into the Bulletin. Then the Bulletin can be exported to Proclaim and run the entire service! [And if we have the sermon add in it can do the preaching [text to speech?] - and the pastors can then get all their work done during the normal work days and relax and worship on the Lord's day]

I wish there were an "amen" emoticon! This is, ultimately, what I'd like to see (unfortunately, I don't get to make the important decisions ... probably for the best). At the moment, there are some limitations as to what we can do with the notation in a hymnal, so I'm reticent to push too many hymnals into publication at this point. But it is in my mind as an option for the future. [:D]

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