Metadata and product page ERRORS: Dix

a) The author should be the same in both places.

b) The language shouldn't be English if the volume is in Greek.

c) Shouldn't the types be Ancient Manuscript + Apparatus?

d) Given the author and the description, I expected an English study or commentary on The Apostolic Tradition. What I got, it seems, was a text critical Latin and Greek edition of the text itself. This is a completely unacceptable way to present a book!

e) All books in the collection should have the same title on the product page and in the metadata.

f) I am incredibly tired of reporting metadata errors! It is your job to get it right. And to get it right before shipping. That's what we pay you for, not for the "privilege" of doing the job for you!

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MJ. Smith

I've had communication with some Logos people who are aware they have a problem with the church fathers, liturgy, etc. i.e. their comparatively new market thrusts. They are working on getting the correct training and workflow going. And, yes, I do trust the people I talked with to do what they say.

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/596667#Comment_596667

Appreciated, and I hope your trust turns out to be well-earned, but I'm not quite sure what it has to do with this particular thread? None of the issues above require any particular training regarding "church fathers, liturgy, etc". If they can get other books right, they should have been perfectly capable to get this right as well. Greek is Greek, whether it's Hippolytus, Philo or the Greek New Testament. The problem here isn't the character of the book, it's an almost complete lack of quality control all across the board.

Rosie Perera

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/597058#Comment_597058

If they can get other books right, they should have been perfectly capable to get this right as well.

There's the rub. They often can't get other books right.

The problem here isn't the character of the book, it's an almost complete lack of quality control all across the board.

Yup.

fgh

Bump.

NB.Mick

I just stumbled over this, since John Stott cited Dix in "The Cross of Christ" and I wanted to look up the quote in context.

d) Given the author and the description, I expected an English study or commentary on The Apostolic Tradition. What I got, it seems, was a text critical Latin and Greek edition of the text itself. This is a completely unacceptable way to present a book!

The point is that we don't get what we paid for. The description "This volume is a study of the early church and the apostolic tradition" (albeit short) is somewhat correct, as it describes the bulk of the text. It should be enhanced with "plus a critical edition of Hippolytus' text".

The book has 192 pages. It is maybe a good idea to split ressources - the issue is we are lacking half of them!

The "study of the early church and the apostolic tradition" is in Dix' General Introduction, which has Roman page numbers and goes until page lii (52)
Then follows a discussion of the existing text variants and (probably) their sources in other documents etc until page lxxxii (82).

The ToC of the printed book looks like this, I put into the box what we don't have at all:

Dix' critical edition of Hippolytus' Treatise follows, which consists of - see screenshot below -

English text, (top box)
Latin text (left box in the middle, LLS:TRTSAPTRDTNLAT),
Greek text (right box in the middle, LLS:TRTSAPTRDTNGK),
cross-references to the bible (might be seen as footnotes to the text, put below the two original language texts),
Critical Apparatus (positioned like footnotes in the lower box, LLS:TRTSAPTRDTNAPP)

I'm most interested in Dix' introduction and the English text - turns out these are the parts we are missing, along with the biblical references.

What we do have looks nice in Logos:

but the issue is what's missing.

b) The language shouldn't be English if the volume is in Greek. This is right, but only the smallest detail. Then again, maybe this confused the text production QA into thinking the English text was delivered where it actually isn't.

NB.Mick

b) The language shouldn't be English if the volume is in Greek.

FWIW I put this up on the metadata corrections page

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601016#Comment_601016

Thanks for the extensive research! (Which you shouldn't have had to do. Logos should have done it before shipping, or at the very least after my OP!)

I also found additional metadata issues. Three editions of the same book, but complete inconsistency when it comes to types, authors, and subjects:

If there's no answer to this thread in an hour or two, I'll send a link to Lou.

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601016#Comment_601016

The ToC of the printed book looks like this, I put into the box what we don't have at all:

I'm seeing those parts in the book. Are you sure you're looking at the right resource? There are four resources from this one book. The resource TATSHRBM should have the introductory material. Would you check again and make sure you don't have it?

Sorry for all the trouble on this. I think some of it is just confusion based on the way the resource was produced (i.e. as four instead of one).

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601123#Comment_601123

Would you check again and make sure you don't have it?

I'm sure I don't have it, and I'm pretty sure Mick doesn't have it either. CS probably missed unlocking it.

And to add to the confusion and list of errors I just realized that two files sort on Treatise and one file sort on The....

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601123#Comment_601123

There are four resources from this one book. The resource TATSHRBM should have the introductory material. Would you check again and make sure you don't have it?

no. I neither own a licence to it, nor seems it to exist on the Logos servers:

logosres:TATSHRBM

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601133#Comment_601133

no. I neither own a licence to it, nor seems it to exist on the Logos servers:

Wow, that is so weird. I'm very sorry about that. I'll put in a request to get it fixed/unlocked.

As for the metadata issues, as MJ said, we know we're having some issues with that and will try to get it resolved ASAP.

Thanks!

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601123#Comment_601123

The resource TATSHRBM should have the introductory material. Would you check again and make sure you don't have it?

Are you sure that that is the file name. It looks like the kind of abbreviation you get on a narrow tab when there is no set abbreviation. The other three filenames start with TRTSAPTRDTN and then some letters more. (And, no, I don't have it whatever the filename is.)

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601139#Comment_601139

The resource TATSHRBM should have the introductory material. Would you check again and make sure you don't have it?

Are you sure that that is the file name. It looks like the kind of abbreviation you get on a narrow tab when there is no set abbreviation. The other three filenames start with TRTSAPTRDTN and then some letters more. (And, no, I don't have it whatever the filename is.)

Earlier today I neither found the text quoted by John Stott in my library (but in the hidden pages of Amazon's look-into), nor another resource that has the text "prayer for the consecration of a bishop" with the Hippolytus content. So it's not an issue of looking at the right file, but of having it.

But thanks Ben that you confirm there's a fourth resource which has what we need - I look forward to see it download some time soon!

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601147#Comment_601147

So it's not an issue of looking at the right file, but of having it.

It looks like I may have given you the wrong file name (I was gave you the abbrev. short title). Would you check to see if you have TRTSAPTRDTN?

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601174#Comment_601174

So it's not an issue of looking at the right file, but of having it.

It looks like I may have given you the wrong file name (I was gave you the abbrev. short title). Would you check to see if you have TRTSAPTRDTN?

No I don't, but it looks right!

Ben Amundgaard (Faithlife)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601179#Comment_601179

No I don't, but it looks right!

OK, I'll get that fixed. Thanks for checking!

fgh

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601186#Comment_601186

So, how many weeks does it take to unlock a file?

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/605173#Comment_605173

So, how many weeks does it take to unlock a file?

At least more than two.... on the other hand, today's resource update fixed the language metadata for the Greek partial resource.

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/601186#Comment_601186

No I don't, but it looks right!

OK, I'll get that fixed. Thanks for checking!

Thanks Ben,

it just downloaded!

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/607300#Comment_607300

Update: I changed the metadata corrections page:

Hippolytus of Rome. The Treatise on the Apostolic Tradition of St. Hippolytus of Rome, Bishop and Martyr (Four resources) – while resource language now has been corrected where it was wrong, the books’ titles and metadata don’t refer any longer to editor Dom Gregory Dix (two do in the resource info, two don’t at all). This is unfortunate, since the one 1937 book they were created from does refer to Dix as author – as does Logos’ product page “Selected Works of Dom Gregory Dix”. Title sort of the Latin text is wrongly not omitting the “The”.

NB.Mick

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/607330#Comment_607330

Thanks Logos (Hayley!) for fixing the author field!