Is it really the Encyclopedia Britannica as we might of thought?

It would have helped enormously in creating proper expectations, if the Comptons derivation had been part of the narrative from the outset.

What is comptons?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compton's_Encyclopedia

I plan to address some of the other concerns first thing in the morning.

I perhaps should wait but this seemed a prime example:

Foucault, Michel

(1926–84). French structuralist philosopher Michel Foucault was born in Poitiers. He studied in Paris under Marxist philosopher Louis Althusser and later taught at the University of Clermont-Ferrand from 1960 to 1968 and the Collège de France from 1970 to 1984. His early work concerned the history of mental illness and society’s response to it. Madness and Civilization (1961) is a study of society’s use of the concept of madness in the 17th century. Discipline and Punish: The Birth of the Prison (1975) is an examination of the origins of the modern penal system. His books argue that asylums and prisons are society’s devices for exclusion and that by surveying social attitudes toward these institutions, one can examine the development and uses of power.

“Foucault, Michel,” Encyclopedia Britannica Noet Edition (Chicago, IL: Encyclopaedia Britannica, 2015).

This is an embarrassing short article on a very important 20th century figure from the humanities, it is extremely short compared to the wikipedia preamble pasted below.

Michel Foucault (French: [miʃɛl fuko]; born Paul-Michel Foucault) (15 October 1926 – 25 June 1984) was a French philosopher, historian of ideas, social theorist, philologist and literary critic. His theories addressed the relationship between power and knowledge, and how they are used as a form of social control through societal institutions. Though often cited as a post-structuralist and postmodernist, Foucault rejected these labels, preferring to present his thought as a critical history of modernity. His thought has been highly influential both for academic and for activist groups, such as within post-anarchism.^[2]

Born in Poitiers, France, into an upper-middle-class family, Foucault was educated at the Lycée Henri-IV and then at the École Normale Supérieure, where he developed an interest in philosophy and came under the influence of his tutors Jean Hyppolite and Louis Althusser. After several years as a cultural diplomat abroad, he returned to France and published his first major book, The History of Madness. After obtaining work between 1960 and 1966 at the University of Clermont-Ferrand, he produced two more significant publications, The Birth of the Clinic and The Order of Things, which displayed his increasing involvement with structuralism, a theoretical movement in social anthropology from which he later distanced himself. These first three histories exemplified a historiographical technique Foucault was developing called "archaeology".

From 1966 to 1968, Foucault lectured at the University of Tunis, Tunisia, before returning to France, where he became head of the philosophy department at the new experimental university of Paris VIII. In 1970 he was admitted to the Collège de France, membership of which he retained until his death. He also became active in a number of left-wing groups involved in anti-racist campaigns, anti-human rights abuses movements, and the struggle for penal reform. He went on to publish The Archaeology of Knowledge, Discipline and Punish, and The History of Sexuality. In these books he developed archaeological and genealogical methods which emphasized the role which power plays in the evolution of discourse in society. Foucault died in Paris of neurological problems compounded by HIV/AIDS; he became the first public figure in France to die from the disease, and his partner Daniel Defert founded the AIDES charity in his memory.

-Dan

Hi Ben.

I would like to know why some of the articles do not seem to be cross-referenced. Where I am concerned, as are others, about the level of detail within the articles, I am also concerned about its usability as a logos resource.

For example:

Abbado, Claudio

(1933–2014). Italian-born orchestra conductor Claudio Abbado succeeded André Previn in 1979 as principal conductor of the London Symphony Orchestra (LSO), a group he had  ...

 Encyclopedia Britannica Noet Edition, 2015.

This snippet refers to Andre Previn. Previn also has an entry in the encyclopedia, and yet this reference is not hyper-linked to that entry. I could not simply click on Andre's name and go there, nor hover to see the article quickly. The very next article, 'Abbas,  Mahmoud' talks about the PLO. Again, the PLO have an entry but it is not linked.

I saw a thread mentioning that full integration with the timeline tool had not happened yet ... Is this linking/tagging also a WIP, or is this how we would expected the resource to work ?

Thanks.

I just tested 10 randomly chosen articles on the Britannica website. The articles I got from Comptons all matched the content of EBNE:

• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9344864/Albany-Law-School
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9273203/Bhutan
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9318970/Giovanni-Benedetto-Castiglione
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9310783/Columba
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9311080/Robert-S-Duncanson
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9274428/Fredericton
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9274957/housing
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9275099/Islamic-literature
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9315044/Jerry-Lee-Lewis
• http://kids.britannica.com/comptons/article-9329405/Bob-Mathias

As others have said the only difference is that the Noet edition has less media and fewer links (see that Castiglione and Duncanson articles for examples).

I simply do not understand why Faithlife has allowed this to happen. The content is clearly written for children, not for adults. The selection of articles clearly does not have Noet users in view.

If this product had been called Encyclopaedia Britannica for Teens (Logos Edition), or Comptons by Britannica, Logos Edition there would have been very few complaints (apart from the missing links). I'm afraid it's yet another case of Logos marketing significantly overblowing a new product to the point that many purchasers feel there has been misrepresentation. That harms Faithlife and the trust you work so hard to build up.

Even if you'd got carried away with the excitement of the initial marketing push, there was plenty of discussion about the content throughout the prepub period. Faithlife staff members were fully involved in that discussion, and had ample opportunity to mention the level of the articles and the link with Comptons. As someone else has said, the failure to do that now seems like smoke and mirrors.

We can buy Comptons for pennies. Of course the Logos edition has added value. From the marketing page: "Look up “John Calvin” in EBNE, find a reference to The Institutes, and with a click you’re taken straight to its full text." Really?

I know I can return the product and get my $100 back. I'll probably do that. But it will take longer to get my trust back.

I didnt know I was preordering kids encyclopedia for $ 199.00

I knew Faithlife would make this right!

Thanks for helping us understand what happened and giving clear and excellent options from which to choose!

I thought they would too...it is a sad thing this mistake happened but I had always known that a refund was the worse case scenario (which is not terrible). I am very happy to hear that things are being corrected. I am content to wait and as a bonus compton may be seen to be an equivalent of strongs dictionary, a base resource to get a supper quick look at something.

-Dan

Just to confirm and be double clear. No more money from me, and I will recieve the Encyclopedia Britannica when it's completed, while still keeping the Compton's version?

Correct.

The TBD makes me nervous (based on what just happened); but otherwise I can't complain.

There may be some number of people who pre-ordered at $99 before the prepub price went up to $199, but have since asked for a refund. If the next pre-pub price is going to be more than $99 you may want to add some provision so that they can still get the new bundle for $99.

That would be me.

Though it would still be nice to know how many articles are going to be in the new EB, before I commit to re-ordering.

Thank you Phil. That apology and fix is certainly good enough for me. I particularly appreciate the clear explanation.

Glad to hear it.

I'm sure you're already doing this, but you'll want to review your procedures to try and make sure something like this doesn't happen again.

Absolutely. We've already discussed steps we can take to make sure this doesn't happen again. One of the main causes was that this was an out-of-the-ordinary product. Normally what we create has a very clear print correspondence. That wasn't the case here. And the confusion between Encyclopaedia Britannica the company, Encyclopedia Britannica the resource, and the mid-range encyclopedia they were licensing to us led to the conflation and confusion.

There may be some number of people who pre-ordered at $99 before the prepub price went up to $199, but have since asked for a refund. If the next pre-pub price is going to be more than $99 you may want to add some provision so that they can still get the new bundle for $99.

We will honor the original Pre-Pub price for those who have canceled already.

I appreciate the frustration and anger you feel over this issue, but I think you need to be very careful about the use of words like "scam" and "lie". I agree that this is a major foul-up, but also see that FL is doing its level best to sort it out and do the right thing by its customers, within the constraints that the licensing arrangements with EB will allow it to. 

My experience with FL over the years has consistently been that they try to do the right thing, and when there is a snafu like this, they generally try to put it right. Flinging unsubstantiated accusations of dishonesty does nothing constructive to resolve the situation, and certainly won't help those in FL like Phil who are trying to sort this out when they see their integrity being impugned on the forums. I am always disappointed on these forums by the way that some posters immediately jump to conclusions that assume the worst motives in FL. 

Should it have happened? No. Is it bad? Yes. As someone who has managed at senior level in large organisations I know that things happen at times that you regret, knew nothing about, but then end up having to sort out. Please let Phil and Bob sort this out before thinking the worst of their motives. All the time they have to spend responding here (and getting disheartened by such comments on here) takes away from time spent sorting things out. 

Please admit your scam and go a long way to repent and put it right.

It sounds very much that you didn't bother to read the thread and see the official Logos response: https://community.logos.com/forums/p/117294/770418.aspx#770418

You've made some serious allegations that conflict significantly with what Faithlife have said since these problems came to light. I suggest you either back those allegations with evidence, you admit you are wrong and go a long way to repent and put your false allegations right.

Hi, I purchased and returned immediately. I have been a Logos customer for about 10 years and have spent tens of thousands of pounds on various products and schemes offered by Faithlife. I use Logos 6 everyday and for the most part enjoy. This smacks of a great lack of integrity on the part of Faithlife in wanting to obtain money, not just for old rope (again), but for a seriously flawed and sub standard product. To say miscommunication is a lie. What am I buying? How much for? are the two basic questions in any business. Please admit your scam and go a long way to repent and put it right. I am seriously considering whether to withdraw my custom and all my support of Logos and their products. Faithlife must set a higher standard as professed followers of Jesus. You have let your customer base down and up your game.

Certainly Faithlife made a major mistake but your response is very strong and doesn't seem to take into account their official explanation of what happened. We must all be very careful not to judge other people's motives because we simply don't know them.

Please admit your scam and go a long way to repent and put it right.

I'm sorry we disappointed you, and that you feel this is a scam.

I hope you'll consider a different possibility, though: we made a mistake, and now we're fixing it.

As a scam, it's actually not even plausible: it cost us the same to process and tag all the wrong articles as to tag the right ones. To fix this problem we'll be incurring significant expense, and effectively doing the same work twice. We didn't deny the error or try to force anyone to accept the wrong database.

You say you've been a customer for ten years; I trust you haven't felt scammed all that time, and hope you'll give us the benefit of the doubt here, and accept what is the true (as well as more plausible!) answer: A company with 24 years of history selling 70,000 different ebooks wouldn't suddenly switch business models to running 'scams' just so they could deliver one of the 70,000 different titles with a different text, which would be instantly discovered by their users, resulting in bad press, bad will, and the expense of re-doing all the work...