Version 2.0

Not saying this is what is going to be called, but this statment by Dave Dunkins seems to me to say that a major update is coming.

The seemingly plateaued state of the app is because we were hitting the limits of what we could do with small changes and are now working on big changes, specifically integrating the full Logos display engine. Big changes take longer. Notes and highlighting are coming, just not as soon as we would all like. Thanks for your patience.

So, if version 2 is coming (or something like it; a major update), here is what I am hoping will be added and possible with the new update.

copy/paste
highlighting/markup
note taking and syncing with desktop
fully offline installation - only needs to be online to sync or download books

That is also in order of importance for me. What do you want?

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Comments

Ron

In addition to the features you listed, I'd like to see (in no particular order)

1. footnotes available offline (not sure whether this is possible/how easy it would be)

2. Some sort of equivalent to the cited by tool

3. Ability to search within offline books (nothing fancy, just a "find" feature within the currently opened book would be nice)

EDIT 4. Oooh, and Biblical People/Places/Things would be AWESOME!

@Dave - I know you can't commit to a date or anything (and I don't expect you to), but any chance of a broad hint of how far out this major update is? Are we talking weeks? Months? Half a year? Tomorrow? [:P] (Kidding on that last one [;)] )

lostlogik

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/181981#Comment_181981

And of course, two windows open at once allowing active linked books.

Matt B

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/181995#Comment_181995

prayer list sync!

Kevin A. Purcell

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/181981#Comment_181981

1. footnotes available offline (not sure whether this is possible/how easy it would be)

3. Ability to search within offline books (nothing fancy, just a "find" feature within the currently opened book would be nice)

Actually these would be solved by what I envision as offline installation.

Fred Greco

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182110#Comment_182110

Prayer list sync

Highlighting that carries over to Logos.

Jonathan

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182117#Comment_182117

In order of importance:

1. Highlighting and Notes (a must); clippings (maybe...)

2. Dual resource view although this may only be practical for the ipad. What's an iphone anyway? :-)

3. Better original language "stuff." I have never enjoyed using original language resources on the Logos ipad app. I would love to see something that could parse (quickly) on the fly when I am listening to a sermon or doing a quick study of the Greek/Hebrew. It needs to be more "snappy" and have the ability to quickly pull up a lexical entry.

4. New UI layout (maybe), or something more Ipad specific. With the Ipad you've got a lot more space for an elegant UI. I am okay with the one we've got, but I could imagine something better.

5. *I am not sure if this is even on their radar, but sentence diagramming on the ipad would, IMHO, be an awesome experience. It would really give you the feeling of "interaction" you miss when you are diagramming with a mouse.

6. How about an integration of book deals, blog articles, and the like. I could see Logos doing a great job with this.

7. A "preaching" portion for the app which would allow linking of information, texts, illustrations, maybe even powerpoint integration (you could even use a Logos button to advance slides running off a computer connected to a wireless network).

Bob Turner

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182120#Comment_182120

great suggestions.

i would especially love to see:

prayer list integration
notes access & able to add/edit
highlighting

Jeremy

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182135#Comment_182135

1. The ability to perform a passage search through a collection.

2. The ability to perform word studies and exegetical studies and bring up all the resources that are linked.

3. THE NA27!

Ron

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182135#Comment_182135

prayer list integration

Absolutely! Forgot that one.

Brent Daniel

My prioritized list of features is as follows:

1. Fully offline installation

2. Fully offline installation

3. ...

The reason for my beating on the "fully offline installation" is that I expect it would include many of the features other users are requesting including:

a. Full support for offline support footnotes and references

b. Viewing highlighting done in Logos 4 ... and likely some highlighting capability (which may have to be simplified due to the constraints of the iTouch form factor.

c. Copy and paste - again potentially constrained due to the form factor

d. Notes ??? I am personally not looking forward to typing notes on a virtual keyboard. Now, if there was a Logos app. for a smartphone that had a decent keyboard - say maybe for the new BB Torch, then note taking may be manageable.

Not saying this is what is going to be called, but this statment by Dave Dunkins seems to me to say that a major update is coming.

The seemingly plateaued state of the app is because we were hitting the limits of what we could do with small changes and are now working on big changes, specifically integrating the full Logos display engine. Big changes take longer. Notes and highlighting are coming, just not as soon as we would all like. Thanks for your patience.

So, if version 2 is coming (or something like it; a major update), here is what I am hoping will be added and possible with the new update.

copy/paste

highlighting/markup

note taking and syncing with desktop

fully offline installation - only needs to be online to sync or download books

That is also in order of importance for me. What do you want?

UncleBob

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182220#Comment_182220

Actually, the iPad is a great option for notetaking on the go (not so much for iPhone though).

You can purchase (from Apple) a real keyboard for the iPad that also props up the iPad (in portrait orientation) right in front of you. It is full size and is a dream to type on.

You can also download an iPad app -- Tap Typing is the name I believe -- which will give you touch typing lessons (and pointers along the way) using your virtual iPad keyboard. It will improve both your typing speed and also accuracy. I enjoy virtual typing (and am much better at it) having worked thru many of the typing lessons.

Personally, I can't WAIT for the iPad/iPhone app to be updated. . .

bob

Tom Geswein

I would like to have a way of looking through my library a little easier. Something similar to the alphabet on the right side of the screen, the way the ipod handles music. It would also be nice to be able to filter your library to only show downloaded resources or those not downloaded (to make downloading easier.)

Linden

Below are my prioritized feature requests:

1. Prayer list sync.

2. Copy/paste

3. Multiple open windows (at least two)

4. Interlinear Bible View

I see that iPad prayer list sync is very popular on this thread. Can everyone that wants this feature vote for it here:

http://logos.uservoice.com/forums/42823-logos-bible-software-4/suggestions/655839-add-prayer-list-on-iphone-ipad-ipod

Jon

I would love to see all of these updates mention previous but I would also like to see

1. folders in favorites and/or

2. Verse lists.

I just want to have lists of verses that are encouraging, for hospital visits, and theological issues i deal with. I like during visits to read a verse or two and it takes a bit longer to try to remember it, then find it, and then read it. It would also be nice to have a start toggle which should be easy enough because it would help just to mark a couple for easy finding when i go to head into a hospital room. I think with either of these additions i would be able to use it the way i want.

Kenneth Neighoff

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182448#Comment_182448

You can purchase (from Apple) a real keyboard for the iPad that also props up the iPad (in portrait orientation) right in front of you. It is full size and is a dream to type on.

I had an old bluetooth keyboard from my Palm days. It is a full sized keyboard and it works with the IPad. This saved me some money.

Ralph A. Abernethy III

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/183124#Comment_183124

1. Highlighting.

2. Note-taking.

3. Copy/paste.

4. Take over mortgage payments.

Bob

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/183275#Comment_183275

The only feature that I really miss is the ability to store a favorite while off the net. It makes reading a lot more difficult if the app cannot remember a place. Notes would be nice, but ONLY if they are accessible (for read and write) when the unit is off the net. If they are online use only - then they would be worthless to me.

Mark A

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/186705#Comment_186705

prayer list sync

copy / paste

Dr. Ivan Ramirez

you guys are doing a great job on the app so far. I would love to see the following

1. Exegetical guide

2. dictionary (like kindle)

3. multiple windows

4. drastically improved home screen

5. everything all the others said

6. cure for cancer

Robert Mullen

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/189236#Comment_189236

1. Exegetical guide

2. Multiple windows / Layouts

3. Notes

4. Full offline mode

5. This year

6. This year

Seriously. The other bible readers out there are doing these things right now and they do them with small teams. I don't mean to be ungracious but I have come to expect a lot from Logos.

rog

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/189236#Comment_189236

I like what is above, two more:

1. Clippings - I use them in my sermon prep and would be very helpful - if I'm limited to notes, I can cross over, but they don't naturally hold the reference material (I think)

2. Don' t limit the iphone because some think you can't take notes on it, or do major work on it. I do and would love to have as many possibilities open to it as "possible"

Thanks for a great app!

PS - like the cure for cancer one too, Ivan! [;)]

James Lum Siak Foong

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/182088#Comment_182088

Yes, agreed, Prayer List to be sync to iPhone, that will be great.

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/190276#Comment_190276

I just wish they would let us know when they think they will be getting it out. I know it could be a long time, but would be nice to know that in a month or two we might have an update to get. I just hope with all the people complaining about it being near useless when offline, that they fix it so we can actually load our books rather than cloud reading. I know the ability to load personal books and all content is the thing i look forward to in a different companies forth coming app (it's in beta but i am not one of the lucky beta testers).

-Dan

Kevin A. Purcell

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/190562#Comment_190562

I know the ability to load personal books and all content is the thing i look forward to in a different companies forth coming app (it's in beta but i am not one of the lucky beta testers).

Are you talking about offline reading? That is in the Logos app now. I'm guessing you know this and that wasn't what you were talking about, but in case it is, just go into your Library and tap the little blue arrow and it will show you a page about the book and there is a switch to turn offline reading on/off.

Bob Turner

copy and paste as well as highlight & prayer lists.

Bob Turner

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/192888#Comment_192888

would really love to see a reverse interlinear for the iPad.

Jeremy

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/192889#Comment_192889

The ability to see all of the alphabetized table of contents of dictionaries. Right now you can only scroll down to part of them which makes finding an entry that does not come up very very difficult.

Randall Hartman

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/193099#Comment_193099

Could someone--anyone at Logos PLEASE give us a projected date for the new release? Is this 5 years out? 5 months? 5 weeks? 5 days? 5 minutes? [8-|]

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/193257#Comment_193257

A week ago we were told a beta was 'close'. iPhone betas are always closed (Apple's decision, not Logos'), so a beta won't get published here, but I guess that might mean that of your suggestions, 5 weeks until release might be the closest (though perhaps a little longer maybe).

Dave Dunkin (Logos)

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/193257#Comment_193257

Less than 5 years, more than 5 days. We are in beta now for the next release, which will be 1.5.

Logan Hall

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/193329#Comment_193329

Less than 5 years, more than 5 days. We are in beta now for the next release, which will be 1.5.

That narrows it down a bit. if you are taking votes... I vote for 5 days. [;)]

Sumair

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/193452#Comment_193452

clipping would be great and note taking and offline search as the basics to do a study offline

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/191069#Comment_191069

I know the ability to load personal books and all content is the thing i look forward to in a different companies forth coming app (it's in beta but i am not one of the lucky beta testers).

Are you talking about offline reading? That is in the Logos app now. I'm guessing you know this and that wasn't what you were talking about, but in case it is, just go into your Library and tap the little blue arrow and it will show you a page about the book and there is a switch to turn offline reading on/off.

No I mean installing from our own computers our own Logos files rather than depending on a cloud model that contains only part of our Libraries.

-Dan

Paul Grobler

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/193465#Comment_193465

clipping would be great and note taking and offline search as the basics to do a study offline

Especially clipping. I see most people bring up note taking in these pages but clipping is also really important to me. When I prepare for assignments, I read through the relevant books and make clippings of the material I require. I use notes afterward to categorize them, making summaries in the process. Both clippings and note would be great!

Bob Pritchett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/189272#Comment_189272

Seriously. The other bible readers out there are doing these things right now and they do them with small teams. I don't mean to be ungracious but I have come to expect a lot from Logos.

Ouch! :-)

The other Bible readers have larger teams, actually -- since their whole team is dedicated to mobile, and we have to share our (larger overall) team with Windows, Mac, web, etc. (And did I mention ours is free? :-) )

The next release isn't going to have everything you want, because the next release just gets the desktop display engine onto the iPhone for use with offline books. This is a major job, since our desktop display engine is very mature and powerful; but it's also essential to making everything else work. And once it's there, we'll have essentially the same display on all platforms. It's like we're behind...and then one day we'll jump way out in front...

Bob Turner

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194253#Comment_194253

the next release just gets the desktop display engine onto the iPhone

wow... wait... does this mean we will have the Home Page on the iPhone & iPad?

or am i reading that wrong?

Ward Walker

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194255#Comment_194255

the next release just gets the desktop display engine onto the iPhone

wow... wait... does this mean we will have the Home Page on the iPhone & iPad?

or am i reading that wrong?

Perhaps it will be the "Home away from Home Page"... [;)]

Dan Francis

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194253#Comment_194253

[The next release isn't going to have everything you want, because the next release just gets the desktop display engine onto the iPhone for use with offline books. This is a major job, since our desktop display engine is very mature and powerful; but it's also essential to making everything else work. And once it's there, we'll have essentially the same display on all platforms. It's like we're behind...and then one day we'll jump way out in front...

Does that mean everything readable by the desktop will be on our iOS devices???? "Same display on all platforms", makes me think that we should be capable of reading all the same files... I do know we will never et everything, everyone wants on their iOS, it;s just not that powerful, but ability to read all of our books offline would have me tickled pink.

-dan

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194255#Comment_194255

the next release just gets the desktop display engine onto the iPhone

wow... wait... does this mean we will have the Home Page on the iPhone & iPad?

or am i reading that wrong?

You are reading it wrong, I'm afraid. What Bob is talking about is the way the various resources are displayed. Currently, the Logos internet server converts all Logos resources from their native format into a simpler XHTML format that the iPhone app understands. This cut down the work that was required to build the app, but it limited what could be achieved beyond displaying simple resources. So the new version won't need the server to convert native Logos files, but will understand them itself.

This should open the way for displaying highlighting, interlinears, complex tables and the like, none of which are currently possible. But how much of this will be possible with the initial release of the display engine, I don't know. The hints that we've had suggest that not all these features will be available immediately.

Alan Charles Gielczyk

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194262#Comment_194262

THE best thing about the iPad app is the book-like reading experience. It sounds like we are about to lose that. I don't know that anyone asked for the same display engine, we just wanted to be able to take notes and highlight. If we lose the book-like reading experience I think it will undo everything good about the app!

spitzerpl

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194294#Comment_194294

THE best thing about the iPad app is the book-like reading experience. It sounds like we are about to lose that. I don't know that anyone asked for the same display engine, we just wanted to be able to take notes and highlight. If we lose the book-like reading experience I think it will undo everything good about the app!

The current Logos Beta has "book-like" reading so it will be available in the next release soon. I imagine this means that the next Ipad app will retain this ability.

Alan Charles Gielczyk

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194298#Comment_194298

Great! I certainly hope so, I would miss that more than anything.

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194294#Comment_194294

THE best thing about the iPad app is the book-like reading experience. It sounds like we are about to lose that. I don't know that anyone asked for the same display engine, we just wanted to be able to take notes and highlight. If we lose the book-like reading experience I think it will undo everything good about the app!

When the developers talk about the display engine changing, they're only talking about the internals of the programming, they're not talking about any external interface or other things changing. Currently, the iPhone app requires the Logos server to 'translate' a normal Logos resource into a much simpler format that the app can display. The display engine will mean that this step is removed, and the app will be able to understand a native Logos file, without 'translation'. The change need have no impact on the user interface at all.

Once the change has been made, it should make it possible to have footnotes in offline resources (because they're included in the native Logos file), and perhaps with a little more tweaking correct the problem that some resources currently display incorrectly (such as interlinears, resources with complex tables, etc.)

Alan Charles Gielczyk

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194429#Comment_194429

Thanks Mark, now I get it. Would this make it easier to bring in highlighting and note taking as well?

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194437#Comment_194437

Would this make it easier to bring in highlighting and note taking as well?

I don't think it would make a difference with note-taking (except perhaps in displaying note indicators), but it would probably make highlighting easier (though still not easy).

Based on the way that Logos normally work in doing things incrementally, I expect v1.5 will have this major 'behind the scenes' change, plus perhaps one or two more visible changes (one or two out of highlighting, notes, interlinears, offline popups, better download options, etc.). It would be unlike Logos to bring out a new version that had many new features all in one go. But hopefully once the display engine is in place, whatever features get missed in 1.5 could be added to 1.6 and 1.7 (hopefully!).

Bob Pritchett

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194294#Comment_194294

THE best thing about the iPad app is the book-like reading experience. It sounds like we are about to lose that. I don't know that anyone asked for the same display engine, we just wanted to be able to take notes and highlight. If we lose the book-like reading experience I think it will undo everything good about the app!

We try to do as much code-sharing as possible between products and platforms, to save time and expense and ensure consistent behavior.

Last year we didn't have time to port the display engine to iOS for the first iPhone app, so, as Mark points out, we served up a limited form of XHTML and used a simple pagination engine. (We didn't have pagination -- reading view -- in the core engine at that time. Only infinite scrolling.)

This year we got navigable pagination into the core desktop display engine (as shown in reading view), and have now ported that engine down to iOS. We will release this as soon as we can; the advantages are as Mark perceptively described: complex tables, richer formatting, etc. (Inline interlinear is possible, too, though that requires new UI to manage which lines are on.)

The other advantage is that this display engine is "character position aware." Converting text to XHTML lost the bi-directional link between the screen position of a word and the underlying "offset". Using our core display engine means we retain this, and can now implement selection, copy, highlighting, notes, etc. and not only display them, but translate your "finger click" to the correct position as well. (We haven't gotten there yet, but I'm pretty sure the common display engine means we'll be able to display all of our complicated highlighting styles as well.)

NOTE: You will need to (re-)download books for offline use to take advantage of the core display engine; if you're reading the book over the air, we will still be sending just the XHTML "article at a time." There should be help in re-downloading your offline books without having to specify them manually.

Mark Barnes

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194527#Comment_194527

if you're reading the book over the air, we will still be sending just the XHTML "article at a time."

Thanks for the clarification, Bob. One question: are you not concerned that having two display engines - one for over the air, one for downloaded resources is going to confuse the user, and made programming more difficult? When you have the new display engine, would it not be possible to have the server send the original Logos file in chunks, so that OTA resources can also be displayed using the new engine?

Bob

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194527#Comment_194527

Bob

Thanks for this preview. I would like to ask you if there are plans to create a new type of note file, one specifically tied to a book. As this application is going to work it would be troublesome to import all of my note files when I would only be using those specific to the individual book I am reading.

You could then attach the highlight info to the same note file for the purpose of import/export to the main app, or even leave them as meta-data within the book (which is where I assume current highlighting is stored).

One extra suggestion, the iBooks app displays the existing highlights in a book as part of its table of contents, this feature would be nice in LOGOS.

Bob

Rev. Kelly Todd

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194527#Comment_194527

Bob, this is really great news, and thank you for letting us in on what is going on! We all want more than we have, but here is yet another request.

I have over 1800 books. I know that some would like to put all 1800 on their iphone, but I also know that some of us would like to have only a few ported over. Would it be possible to make in the PC/Mac interface a place for us to list only the books that we would like to have on our iphone? That way I can put, say the 50 or so that I use the most in the list, and then send them over. Each time that I would go to logos, it would make sure that my books were updated and If I added or removed books it would add to or subtract from my phone. This would also make it easier for us in that if we wanted all of our books on the Iphone, we could just press one button, however the rest of us would still have to add them one at a time, but by having this list we could just check a box for the resource and it would be added to the list and then added to our phone... still essentially a one button move to add the resource to the phone. This would be very handy to me and I believe to many others as well. Please consider this one! Thank you and to all at Logos, a very blessed and happy Thanksgiving!

Kelly

Alan Charles Gielczyk

https://community.logos.com/discussion/comment/194536#Comment_194536

Thanks Bob! One more question, will this impact the file size of the resources? I am one who wants every resource on my iPad and I hope the new file format will not be prohibitive.