Resource I.D. codes (missing? or a new "feature")

In L3 the following "1000BBLIMB.lbxlls" is on the meta date page and is the"unique" identifier for "1000 Biblical Images".

That same piece of information is also located in (whichever) Resource Drawer that particular resource is in on our hard drives..

I can not find this "code" etc in the L.4. Library Info, or anywhere else within L4.

Is this "deliberate" ie. a 'new" feature - or is it a "bug"?

I have always made great use of these codes. They helped me discover and re-locate resources. I'm not sure if they appeared anywhere else besides the "About Resource" pane (some served as the "name" of the "download" link when purchasing from the web page)?.

IF it is NOT a part of L4 - how am I able to discern which code in the resource folder goes to which resource OR will I even have that access at all?

Presently I have to have L3 up and running to identify specific ID Codes for L4 Resources.

(This question arose because I was still trying to hide/remove the targums/Cairo paprii etc from L4. Which raises a further question: If I had been faster to hide/remove them from L3 before installing the beta would I now be having to "put-up" with them taking up very visible space within the Library?)

Aside:

In my XP system L4 seems to keep these codes of the (indexed) resources here:

C:\Documents and Settings\"name"\Local Settings\Application Data\Logos4\Data\x1dsklus.tt5\ResourceManager\Resources

I've not been able to discover any other locations.

Steve

ps. Please forgive me if this seems to be demanding too much control. And, yes, I realize that I do not have this same access within a lot of the other (competing?) Bible Software programs. BUT it is one that I have HEAVILY used in L3. And I really enjoyed being able to customize the program in that fashion. Big Smile

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Comments

Robert Pavich

Steve,

this has been discussed on the forum; but I don't have a link for you...but I can summarize.

The reason that we liked the resource codes in V3 was that we were manipulating the files; dumping the ones we didn't want...making sure we had all that we were owed...etc.

In V4 the philosophy is that Logos will take care of that. It will search our library; if we don't have something we should have...then it silently reinstalls it...no need to go looking to make sure that a certain book was included in your last backup.

I had also read here (I thought) that we'd have the option to "hide" titles and Logos would note it and not try and reinstall it to our HDD.

that's my recollection anyway...it seems like a good system; I've had books in my library go missing for months until I realize that I didn't have something that I should have.

SteveF

Dear Robert: Thanks for your reply.

So basically I think you are saying that "No" - ie. "what we had before is now gone."

And Yes, I applaud Logos helping us be sure we have all of our resources...

It's just,..until I really see it in action in a specific instance, I guess I just feel that we have then "lost" something? Or as you put it so well: (no longer having the ability of "manipulating files"?)

I realize that in some ways we are coming at this from the opposite direction -- I am not so much afraid of missing files, but more wanting to know "what" a particular file is. Does that come through in my question?

Unfortunately, we are so early into this process that I really do not yet know if this is will be a big concern going forward.

But, now assuming with you that it is gone, I already miss this L3 feature.

Thanks

Steve

Dave Hooton

this has been discussed on the forum; but I don't have a link for you...but I can summarize.

Logos do not want us rummaging around the v4 resource drawer
Logos will allow us to add files to the drawer using a scan command (see Beta 2 Release Notes)
Hide is a projected feature to get rid of stuff like Targums, but right now Beta 2 will silently re-install any "missing" resources

So far I've avoided my "missing" Targums being installed by setting "Use Internet" to No in Tools | Program Settings immediately after Beta 2 was installed. But I don't know that this can continue for future Betas when new and updated Logos4 resources will be available to replace the v3 ones.

Bob Pritchett has resisted suggestions to bring back crude functions like Location Manager and Bibliography which can show resource locations.

SteveF

Hi David:

I think I liked Robert's "manipulating" more than your "rummaging" [6]

Steve [:D]

Dave Hooton

I think I liked Robert's "manipulating" more than your "rummaging"

Yes, it's a little old fashioned but I avoided an older English term which is now thought to be rude, meaning "to poke or dig about" (per Merriam-Webster) or "discover and bring to light" (more politely). Logos would prefer we never knew where the resource folder is!

Bob Pritchett

A) We're improving metadata and adding some new features to do things like keep Targums out of your primary Bible pickers, etc. (They should already be grouped separately in most cases, along with "fragmentary" Bibles that represent papyri.)

We will add a cloud-aware "resource hiding" function, and unlike deleting a file on your hard-drive, it will remember what you've hidden and sync it over multiple installs / machines / etc.

I appreciate all the feedback, even when it wears me down. (Okay, some days I don't appreciate it, but you'd get grumpy too if you had to read 5,400 forum messages in two weeks. <smile>) And much of what you're asking for will show up in future versions.

Some things just aren't going to, though. I feel terrible saying it -- I want to make everyone happy! -- but in some cases we're going to make solutions that go the other direction. For example: instead of taking our three complicated resource management tools/reports and adding the requested fourth and fifth tools, we're just going to take resource management away from users.

I am listening, and I do get that you want to manage your files, control disk space usage, identify missing resources, lookup the names of resources by ID when they're reported licensed but not present, etc. But the price of these power user features is an insanely expensive amount of technical support.

Example: Many 3.x power users generate a report of their licenses and files to see if they're missing any books. Then they try to get from the FTP server or a disk. And when they can't find a resource, they call or email. But some of the licenses in the system don't have books -- they're for internal features or even for books that don't yet exist, which we thought might be added (as a free bonus) to collections retroactively. These calls/emails/etc. take a lot of time, and it's hard to track down the answers. To which some users have suggested we build a web site where you can lookup a license ID and get its metadata. But that's even more code, more to explain, etc.

We spend roughly $300,000 per year supporting resource management calls and emails. (Aside from all the other issues!) And most of those users don't want to worry about it, or even to get more control; they tell us they just want it to work.

So in this particular case (and some others) we are going to go with the majority, and with the stats. We'll try to accomodate your requests as best we can -- allowing hiding of resources in a "cloud-compatible" way, for example -- but we just can't (or won't) support everything.

J.R. Miller

Example: Many 3.x power users generate a report of their licenses and files to see if they're missing any books. Then they try to get from the FTP server or a disk. And when they can't find a resource, they call or email. But some of the licenses in the system don't have books -- they're for internal features or even for books that don't yet exist, which we thought might be added (as a free bonus) to collections retroactively. These calls/emails/etc. take a lot of time, and it's hard to track down the answers. To which some users have suggested we build a web site where you can lookup a license ID and get its metadata. But that's even more code, more to explain, etc.

Bob, please indulge my quick history. My undergrad is in Engineering. I have never shied away from the technical stuff and can "geek" out with the best of them. I have done many of the things you cite above. But quite honestly, when it comes to my Bible study, I am tired of it too. I just want it to work so I don't have to mess with it. I would prefer you spend 300k on books, software development (especially for the Mac [:D]) and other cool features instead of making computer nerds happy.

Many of us are pastors on this forum, and I think we have taken our share of heat for making tough decisions when we know not everyone will be happy. Thank you for your honesty, your time in explaining things to your customers, and for making these tough decisions regarding resource allocation.

Thanks. I am glad to stand with you on this one brother![:)]

Simon’s Brother

I appreciate all the feedback, even when it wears me down. (Okay, some days I don't appreciate it, but you'd get grumpy too if you had to read 5,400 forum messages in two weeks. <smile>) And much of what you're asking for will show up in future versions.

Some things just aren't going to, though. I feel terrible saying it -- I want to make everyone happy! -- but in some cases we're going to make solutions that go the other direction. For example: instead of taking our three complicated resource management tools/reports and adding the requested fourth and fifth tools, we're just going to take resource management away from users.

Bob, it might not appear like it , but we do appreciate your efforts, and I appreciate you are not writing this software for me specially so I don't expect you to make me 100% happy..... your doing a great job at the moment under difficult circumstances....

Just to clarify ,l what you have done with resource management is great . I'm not saying you've got it totally wrong... just taken it a bit to far. The particular concern I was raising here is that it does not seem very clear at the moment how you envision Logos 4 to be moved to a new computer... there is no option to export and import license, you seem to prefer we don't know where the resources are stored...and then there's the indexes.... at the moment it seems you want us to do all of this through the cloud and then re-index everything on new computer or OS re-install as the case may be... this doesn't seem effiecent at all particuarly when I think of a user who might have download limits coming into play....

Maybe you have a solution for this but haven't gotten around to it...

Robert Pavich

But quite honestly, when it comes to my Bible study, I am tired of it too. I just want it to work so I don't have to mess with it. I would prefer you spend 300k on books, software development (especially for the Mac ) and other cool features instead of making computer nerds happy.

Many of us are pastors on this forum, and I think we have taken our share of heat for making tough decisions when we know not everyone will be happy. Thank you for your honesty, your time in explaining things to your customers, and for making these tough decisions regarding resource allocation.

Thanks. I am glad to stand with you on this one brother!

I agree with you Joe...except on that comment about the Mac! [:O]

Bob Pritchett; you won't make everyone happy all of the time, you DIDN't make me happy on every count in V3! but I learned to love it and use it effectively....the same applies here.

Juanita

We will add a cloud-aware "resource hiding" function, and unlike deleting a file on your hard-drive, it will remember what you've hidden and sync it over multiple installs / machines / etc.

So in this particular case (and some others) we are going to go with the majority, and with the stats. We'll try to accomodate your requests as best we can -- allowing hiding of resources in a "cloud-compatible" way, for example -- but we just can't (or won't) support everything.

I know Bob P. is "gone" for a while but I just read his post and am unclear about these two comments he made. I don't want to misinterpret them. When I first bought the Scholar's Library, Series X, there were a lot of resources I knew I would never used so just chose not to install them. The licenses are mine. The hard drive is mine, last time I checked [:D] Now, does "remember what you've hidden and sync it over multiple installs" mean that resources I delete from my Program files folder will be put back on even if I don't want them back on or does it mean that if I remove them or hide them then the sync will do the same to my other computer? I don't expect Bob to answer but if someone could comment, I would so appreciate it. Thanks.

Dave Hooton

Now, does "remember what you've hidden and sync it over multiple installs" mean that resources I delete from my Program files folder will be put back on even if I don't want them back on or does it mean that if I remove them or hide them then the sync will do the same to my other computer?

Stuff you hide will be sync'd everywhere. Stuff you delete will be restored everywhere. And then you will have a long Indexing session...

Adam Couturier

Can we trade in the titles we don't use for credit on another title? I have several titles that would fall into this category.

Juanita

Stuff you hide will be sync'd everywhere. Stuff you delete will be restored everywhere. And then you will have a long Indexing session...

Dave, I've come up with a rough analogy just to make sure I get this right. Say I buy a Christmas tree bundle including the tree, the lights, bulbs and tinsel. I don't really want the tinsel but it came with the package. I put it up and decorate the tree the way I want and go to bed; my back door is unlocked. When I get up in the morning, I find tinsel on my tree and I didn't put it on or want it on. The manufacturer put it on. So, I take it off.

If I don't put a resource on my hard drive, then will Logos put it on?; I take if off and force indexing and every time they put it back, it re-indexes and every time I take it off, it re-indexes. I took this to the nth degree just to see if I get the point. What I am fighting is the automatic stuff that I don't want but am almost forced to have because I want the tree. Is there no way out of this? Please correct me.

Bradley Grainger (Logos)

I can not find this "code" etc in the L.4. Library Info, or anywhere else within L4.

Not sure if you noticed already, but this has been added (but--I think--wasn't mentioned in the release notes). In a resource window, click the (i) in the upper right to show resource information. At the bottom is a "Support Info" section with the ID and version of the resource.

SteveF

I am not sure when that appeared but it has been very handy the last couple of days trying to sort out all the "gifts" as reflected within my L3 Account Summary.

thanks again,

steve