surely not 50%+ better ?!
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I will double quote myself for emphasis:MJ. Smith said:I find nothing in fair use rules at Stanford or Columbia to substantiate your claims either re:destroying the copy when it is personal notes or that education is a holy cow.
Super Tramp said:Super Tramp said:edit: Vladimir, I do understand exactly how you are applying this process and I have no problem with it.
Personal notes are just fine. That is why I have no problem with Vladamir's use of the PBT that way. But the "educational use" of copyrighted matertial only allows temporary, short term use and requires destruction of all copies when that specific occasion has been concluded.
My own conscience is fine with the many court rulings that side with consumers allowing conversion of formats of material the consumer has purchased a license for. (i.e. making a backup copy of a CD or making a cassette recording of an lp record) I love it that Logos has chosen to allow us to use purchased resources on many different platforms. Not everyone else is that progressive. Just because I can scan C.S. Lewis books and make L4 Personal Books out of them does not mean it is legal. And just because I have a legal right does not mean some publisher won't sue me or some judge won't find in their favor.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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I think overall you have to decide how you are going to use the books, if you are going to use them for research, get them for Logos, if you are just going to read them for fun get the Kindle edition.
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Vladimir Lukyanov said:
I was excited to see vyrso.com offering "thousands" of Christian books. My delight was short-lived however. Although their selection in Christian ebooks may be broader (can anyone confirm that, maybe by posting Vyrso books that are not yet availble on Amazon) than Amazon's at the moment, I am amazed that Logos is charging 50% more than the same item on Amazon.
We're still evaluating where to land on pricing. However, we've just made a significant adjustment that I think you'll find much more competitive. We may not always be able to match Amazon, but I think you'll find us much closer now (and for books under $10 DLP, we'll often beat them). In some cases, the problem is that the DLP (digital list price) that the publishers provided us is higher than the one Amazon has. We're working to identify those and get them adjusted. If you notice any, feel free to report them.
Vladimir Lukyanov said:What am I missing? What features would justify me paying 50% or MORE for such a commodity item? A book is a book is a book.
Here are a few thoughts on why you might choose to spend a little more on Vyrso books than you would elsewhere:
- One license for all your content. IMO, this is huge. If you go with another platform, your ebook reading and your Bible study are in two separate worlds with an insurmountable chasm between them. Your ebooks will never be accessible within your Bible study world, and your Bible study materials will never be accessibile in your ebook world. Buying Vyrso ebooks means all your content is available on all Vyrso apps, Logos apps, Biblia.com, and anywhere else we decide to make it available in the future.
- Tagged Bible references. It's not a knock-your-socks-off feature, but it is nice. And it's just one indication that demonstrates that we want to make the Christian ebook experience better. Other similar features may follow. It's highly unlikely the bigger players in the ebook market will ever implement Christian-specific features.
- Cross-library searching. Other ebook platforms may let you search a single book at a time. With Vyrso you can search across your entire library at once.
- Free upgrades? We probably aren't going to have Vyrso and Logos editions of the same books. We'll license one or the other. However, in some cases we may license a book in Vyrso format and later decide that it would be better as a Logos book. Don't quote me on this—it still needs more internal discussion—but one approach we could take in this situation is to give everyone a free upgrade to the Logos edition when we retire the Vyrso edition. So you may get the quality of a Logos book for the price of a Vyrso book.
- Help make Logos better. If Vyrso is a success for us, everyone wins. We'll have the ability to invest more resources not just into Vyrso, but into making Logos Bible Software an even more amazing product.
Vladimir Lukyanov said:I for one would prefer reading my Logos books (or Christian trade books) on a Kindle and not visa versa.
And you may soon be able to. Amazon is probably soon announcing their new tablet (Kindle Fire?), which will run a modified version of Android. Presumably, the Vyrso and Logos Android apps could run on the device, giving you the ability to access your library there.
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Phil -
Great Post. Thanks for the update!
Don't Quote Me On This said:Free upgrades? We probably aren't going to have Vyrso and Logos editions of the same books. We'll license one or the other. However, in some cases we may license a book in Vyrso format and later decide that it would be better as a Logos book. Don't quote me on this—it still needs more internal discussion—but one approach we could take in this situation is to give everyone a free upgrade to the Logos edition when we retire the Vyrso edition. So you may get the quality of a Logos book for the price of a Vyrso book.
OK. I didn't "quote" you. [:)] However, I REALLY like this idea. Perhaps it could be considered as the "pre-pub" discount?
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Phil Gons said:
Free upgrades? We probably aren't going to have Vyrso and Logos editions of the same books. We'll license one or the other. However, in some cases we may license a book in Vyrso format and later decide that it would be better as a Logos book. Don't quote me on this—it still needs more internal discussion—but one approach we could take in this situation is to give everyone a free upgrade to the Logos edition when we retire the Vyrso edition. So you may get the quality of a Logos book for the price of a Vyrso book.
I know this is a bit old, but I'd like to hear more about this so I'm reviving this thread.
Has a formal decision been made. If this was given as a reason to buy Vyrso books by an employee of Logos and then they choose officially to not offer this upgrade, then it might constitute a dishonest sales tactic. I understand it isn't a legal commitment since he said, "Don't quote me on this..." but people might take Phil up on this and start buying Vyrso books only to feel a little duped if the choice goes the other way.
Dr. Kevin Purcell, Director of Missions
Brushy Mountain Baptist Association0 -
This was discussed a couple of days ago at http://community.logos.com/forums/p/53707/392033.aspx#392033, which also has a more recent quote.
Mac Pro (late 2013) OS 12.6.2
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Super Tramp said:
I have never purchased an eBook from Amazon. Do they allow you to access the book from multiple devices? I was under the impression they do not.
Let me correct you wrong impression. Yes, they do. My Kindle books read fine on the computer, the iPad, the iPhone, and other devices as well.
"In all cases, the Church is to be judged by the Scripture, not the Scripture by the Church," John Wesley0 -
One thing I appreciate with Logos/Vyrso is the ability to share or copy longer quotes. I wanted to share even a paragraph length portion from Kindle version and it gets cut off. I don't have that problem with Vyrso resources.
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Regardless of how the prices between the two companies might sit, a quick look at the ethics of both companies should clearly set your mind at ease doing business with Logos/Vyrso and quickly cause you to swear off doing any future business with Amazon.
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The Redlines said:
quick look at the ethics of both companies
common misconception - companies don't have "ethics," people do. A logical conclusion of your argument is to never do any business with a company that does anything wrong or sinful, including, but not limited to:
- never use a gas station - they sell alcohol
- never drive a car for that matter - all car manufacturers support ungodly causes
- never be a citizen of any country - they are all unholy
- etc.
if we are talking about practical reality - we are stewards. Reputation of the company is not the only consideration, price is one as well. Somewhere in the middle lies the balance...
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Paul Newsome said:
I'm not sure I'm understanding why some users are putting such an extremely high priority (hill to die on level) on prices in Vyrso, especially in regard to Amazon.com. I value more having all of my resources "on one shelf" instead of needing two programs to access them.
look, Paul, this is your deserved, but still personal opinion, Do you prefer a one "do everything" vehicle, or do you have a minivan and another car?
if one truly had many (paper) books, they might not even have them in the same room. Most would be in the Library, some in the kitchen (cookbooks), some in the Living room (picture books), some in the garage (car manuals). Even if I have 10000 books, I guarantee you, I can remember what I have in Vyrso, what in Logos and what in Kindle. Not an issue. 4x Price would be an issue
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toughski said:Paul Newsome said:
I'm not sure I'm understanding why some users are putting such an extremely high priority (hill to die on level) on prices in Vyrso, especially in regard to Amazon.com. I value more having all of my resources "on one shelf" instead of needing two programs to access them.
look, Paul, this is your deserved, but still personal opinion, Do you prefer a one "do everything" vehicle, or do you have a minivan and another car?
if one truly had many (paper) books, they might not even have them in the same room. Most would be in the Library, some in the kitchen (cookbooks), some in the Living room (picture books), some in the garage (car manuals). Even if I have 10000 books, I guarantee you, I can remember what I have in Vyrso, what in Logos and what in Kindle. Not an issue. 4x Price would be an issue
...and I still enjoy this nearly 2 years later! (we do own 2 vehicles because we have multiple drivers in the family... only one digital book reader) The ironic part on the link regarding Adoniram Judson is that Vyrso marked it down to 2.99 for at least a week. I took advantage of this and many of the other discounts throughout the summer. I will say I check the "Best Deals" filter on Vyrso.com regularly.
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Paul Newsome said:
I will say I check the "Best Deals" filter on Vyrso.com regularly.
bummer, I only check the "free" filter. Seriously, this title was on sale on Vyrso?
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