Changes to logos4 links coming to v39 and v40
Heads up that we'll be removing the ability to create logos4 links in v39 and v40. But don't worry. Existing logos4 links will continue to work, and everything you could do with logos4 links, you can now do with ref.ly links.
Here's why we're making the change:
- For years, ref.ly links have had the same functionality as logos4 links.
- logos4 links sometimes got blocked by other apps (bad!), but when they worked, they opened the desktop app directly (good!), which meant they worked offline (also good!). But when you pasted them into other apps, they weren't recognized as links, so they wouldn't be automatically clickable (bad!).
- ref.ly links never got blocked by other apps (good!), but they opened the web app, and then the web app opened the desktop app (bad!). They didn't work offline (also bad!). But, when pasted into other apps, they'd be automatically recognized and made clickable (good!).
- Now, from v39 on Windows and earlier on Mac, Logos listens for clicks on ref.ly links. From almost all apps, apart from web browsers, the desktop app will open directly without first opening the web app. That works offline, too.
- As a result, the advantages that logos4 links had over ref.ly links have all but gone away. This means there's no real need to create new logos4 links, and we can simplify the app by removing that option.
- So now, instead of choosing between two "sometimes good" options, you'll only have one "nearly always good" option.
- There's a bigger picture, too. There are often two — or more! — similar-but-not-quite-the-same ways of doing things in Logos. This makes the app more complex, which makes it harder for users to learn, and harder for us to maintain our code. We can't fix all that overnight, but we are slowly unifying features where we can, and we're not creating new tools where we can improve old ones. This is a small step along that road.
The ability to create logos4 links will likely be removed from the dynamic toolbar in v39 and from the panel menus in v40.
Comments
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Now, from v39 on Windows and earlier on Mac, Logos listens for clicks on ref.ly links. If those clicks happen outside the web browser, then the desktop app will open directly without first opening the web app. That works offline, too.
Wonderful! I love it! Thank you!
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So will old Logos4 links we have created in our Notes still work?
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Yes. Hopefully covered in the initial post:
Existing logos4 links will continue to work
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
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Missed that. Thanks!
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To confirm and clarify, the "Share > Copy Link" will allow us to create links to specific resources in specific locations in those resources and work with web and desktop versions of Logos going forward?
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That is correct, yes.
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I am running 39 Beta 2 on Windows 11 and ref.ly links still open in the browser first. I have restarted my computer after the update but am not sure what else I can do to get it working.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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exactly the same here. This doesn't work (yet).
Have joy in the Lord!
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So I want to make sure I understand, it will still default to the web app if the link is in the browser? Am I understanding that correctly?
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For those who find this isn't working, can you let us know what app you've pasted a ref.ly link into.
Could you also please test with either Apple Notes or WordPad and see if the link works there.
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Is there any way, and there may not be, to have a way to set those to open the app if it is present on the system?
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Wordpad does work as expected. Microsoft Word and Powerpoint open the browser first. If I create a shortcut on my desktop to a ref.ly link, it also opens the browser. Personally, Powerpoint is where I am most likely to put the links, since I will put shortcuts to Logos searches and tools in my presentations to quickly demonstrate in class.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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Wordpad does work as expected. Microsoft Word and Powerpoint open the browser first. If I create a shortcut on my desktop to a ref.ly link, it also opens the browser.
Exactly the same here. Apple Notes on Windows? And who uses Wordpad anyway? Somebody really should think again about the use cases…. When it works on Word and Powerpoint, it works, otherwise, it doesn't.
Have joy in the Lord!
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It does open the app (sometimes not really predictably for me whether Logos or Verbum comes up), no need to configure it that way. The problem is that it opens the web app first - and for offline usage, that it then sits at a browser tab displaying "no internet" without opening the app.
Have joy in the Lord!
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I asked people to try it on Apple Notes and WordPad because one of those apps would be available to every user. I wanted to know whether a specific app caused the problem or whether the problem was system-wide. That's the most useful information I could pass on to the developers.
We've since discovered there's a bug in Microsoft Office on Windows, which means that Office doesn't respect the system settings that Microsoft themselves recommend developers use 🤦. We have a workaround for that bug here.
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Thanks for the report. We've spent some time investigating these reports and have a bit more information to share here
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I see. Yeah, I wouldn't want the web app to come up at all if Logos is on the device I am using. Hmm… 🧐
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Awesome. Thank you for the quick work on this. It is a great feature.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
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When I copy the share link from a clippings or passage list from the webapp and add the link on mobile Bible Study Builder, the links then open the webapp. It does not open in Logos app on IOS or Ipad Os.
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Thanks for the report. I experienced something similar over the weekend. I'll ask the team to look into it.
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@Lukas — Apparently, the first time you attempt to open a ref.ly link after installing the app, iOS will ask whether you want to open it in the app or in Safari. If you choose Safari, iOS will remember that choice and not ask you again.
To persuade iOS to start opening the links again, you can follow these steps:
- Paste a ref.ly link into the Apple Notes app. Any link will do, such as this one: https://ref.ly/Mk1.1;esv. It's possible that sending the link to yourself in iMessage or the Mail app might work, too, but I didn't test that.
- Long press on the link.
- When prompted, open the link in "Logos Bible".
From now on, any ref.ly link should open in the Logos app.
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@Mark Barnes (Logos) I dont get an option to open in Logos App when long pressing
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@Lukas With Mark's link, I'm experiencing the same thing on my iPad - no option to open in the Logos app, and the link opens directly in Biblia.com (🤔). On the iPhone, there is a quick attempt to open a browser page before the link opens in the Logos app.
With ref.ly links for books, the experience is different on the iPad - the link goes first to app.logos.com, and then I'm given the option to open in the mobile app.
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@Yasmin Stephen I don't get any option at all. So I don't know if this is normal or not. And I also don't know if the ref.ly is compatible with documents like passage list and clippings. As that is what I am using it for.
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@Mark Barnes (Logos) can we please get the ref.ly links sorted out and working with everything before you disable the function. I am a mobile user mostly and I use the l4 links to add clippings and passage list documents to my Bible Study document. But the web app I can’t copy a link for clippings but passage list it has the option. But then the problem is I cant get Logos app to open the passage list I added with the share link to open in the app. It keeps opening the web app even with the steps you have mentioned. I dont get any option to open in logos app. So please fix everything before you stop the l4 links. We as mobile users will be without a functioning feature.
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To persuade iOS to start opening the links again, you can follow these steps:
- Paste a ref.ly link into the Apple Notes app. Any link will do, such as this one: https://ref.ly/Mk1.1;esv. It's possible that sending the link to yourself in iMessage or the Mail app might work, too, but I didn't test that.
- Long press on the link.
- When prompted, open the link in "Logos Bible".
From now on, any ref.ly link should open in the Logos app.
I’ve just done this and was able to successfully open the ESV link in the Logos Bible app
However, even after that, trying to access a link to a notebook linked to in a Bible Study document opens on the web and not in the mobile app
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Thanks for the feedback. I'll ask someone on the mobile team to take a look.
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@Mark Barnes (Logos) can we please get something for us mobile users to be able to add link for a clippings document. On mobile we have no option of sharing or copying of link, and then again on web app we are not able to get a link from a clippings document. So I ask very nicely can we postpone the l4 links until we as mobile users have fully functional link platforms that works be it either web app or mobile, but we need one functional system as a mobile user.
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@Mark Barnes (Logos) I ask you again, regarding this ref.ly changes. To please get a working solution before ending a working function. I have copied the share link from a Bible Study Document, I then add the link to note. When I click on the note in web app the links open a new tab in browser and then says the Bible Study document cant be viewed, I must download the Logos Desktop app. What I dont understand is how can web app create the document but cant open it. Then on mobile if I open the note and press and hold the link and you get options to open in left or or bottom, or new tab nothing happens also. This is really a big big frustration. So please get a working solution and a fully functional application for mobile users before removing functions that worked for mostly mobile users. Not all Logos users as desktop users. So please start to think about the people that uses logos on mobile 90-100% of the time.
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Ok so it seems that the Logos app only sees the ref.ly link to open in the app. But when you copy the link from a document you get the flshare.net and these are not opening in the Logos app. So the problem is in the document share.
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Thanks for digging. We haven't changed the behavior of the flshare.net links, but I'll ask the team whether that's something we ought to do.
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@Mark Barnes (Logos) can you please explain to me, if that is the only link we can get from the web app, and this is not something planned, how will we as mobile users then be able to add clipping, Notebook, Passage List documents to the Sermon or Bible Study Builder. Then we as mobile users have the option to add them but the functionality is not available for mobile users.
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@Lukas it sounds like you're encountering a bug, but unfortunately I'm having a very hard time understanding your workflow. (And I'm not sure how changing the desktop application to generate Refly links, the subject of this thread, is impacting your use of mobile and web.) Can you post a simple step-by-step list of how you're creating the links (in which apps), and where you're seeing the incorrect behaviour? Screenshots would be helpful, too.
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@Bradley Grainger (Logos) so my concern is the following. I make use of Bible Study Builder. I create a Notebook,Passage List and clippings document for that study. So with l4 links not going to work anymore, I understand that we must now get a link from web app the people that are using mobile. So I then copy the flshare.net link that is provided from the share function on the document . See photo
That copy link then gives you flshare.net link and I then paste it in the Study Builder info section at the add link section see photo
Then on Mobile the link is add which I added via copy link function from webb app. I want to open the passage list link from the mobile study builder when needed. See photo
But when doing that it opens the document in web app. The L4 links worked perfectly for clippings and passage list, but you are ending that function. So I want to know what other method or function will be available for me as mobile users to continue how the l4 links worked.
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When I click on the note in web app the links open a new tab in browser and then says the Bible Study document cant be viewed, I must download the Logos Desktop app.
That message is a bug which we didn't know existed. We'll get that fixed. Thanks for the report.
can we postpone the l4 links until we as mobile users have fully functional link platforms that works be it either web app or mobile, we need one functional system as a mobile user
It's a good call out that creating links from many documents in the mobile app has never been possible. None of the work we're doing here changes that, but we'll see if we can add support for creating links in the future.
But, as far as I know, the work we're talking about in this thread doesn't make the existing system worse or better, so I don't think there's a benefit in postponing this change until the problem you describe is fixed. Please let me know if I've misunderstood.
Regarding flshare.net links, they were designed to open in a browser. I'll discuss with the team whether that's still the right approach.
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@Mark Barnes (Logos) In the Bible Study info section there is a add link option see photo
So when I create a clippings/pasage list document I have added the l4 link in there in the mobile app. Then when I need to open that passage list document I used that link and then logos mobile opened the document. So my question is will I still be able to make use of the l4 method or will there be an alternative to the l4 as you say that flshare.net is designed to open in web app.
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@Lukas, in the workflow you shared, it seems like you are grabbing the Flshare link from the "Share" button in the web app, which as Mark mentioned is at the moment designed to be handled in a web browser.
I think you can get your desired behavior by copying the Ref.ly link to the location of your Passage list/Notebook/Clipping. This can still be done from the desktop app, by clicking on the top right "kebab" button and selecting "Copy location as URL".
In a resource panel with the new dynamic toolbar, this link would be available under "Share > Copy link"
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@David Vela (Logos) it seems you don't understand my concern about the whole situation. As a mobile user I mean that I am a mobile user 100% of the time. So I don't have access to logos desktop always. So currently I can add the l4 links by typing them manually on my ipad in that study document. But when the l4 links function will no longer work that option to add my documents to the study document will no longer be possible. As once again as a mobile user that does not always have access to logos desktop and web app and mobile app not able to get a ref.ly link that option that helps me a lot is not available. Do you understand my concern. I don't own my own logos desktop.
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So currently I can add the l4 links by typing them manually on my ipad in that study document. But when the l4 links function will no longer work
This is not happening. You can still type L4 links and they will still work.
From the original post in this thread:
But don't worry. Existing logos4 links will continue to work, and everything you could do with logos4 links, you can now do with ref.ly links.
You can still keep creating L4 links by typing them manually, just as you have always been doing.
And we'll plan how we can improve the ability to create and share links within the mobile apps (so you don't have to run the desktop application).
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Hi Mark —
While we are the subject of links…
I finally got some time to play a bit with this tonight. Creating a link in a Markdown editor (in my case, Obsidian, but it could be DevonThink, Bear, Capacities, AnyType, etc), links are so far working ok with Bibles. It would be nice if it would fetch the Bible reference for the linking text title (instead of the generic LSB text), but that might be something I need to tweak further on my end.
Monographs are working fine as well:
You can also create a link from Logos notes, which I assume will be migrated to your new type of linking, but as it currently is, it allows me to link a note to an external note editor.
I have mixed results of linking apps back to notes in Logos, but I suspect this will have to be looked at when the Logos notes editor is developed further. Maybe we would eventually see the ability to use markdown?
My big wish list is to be able to use HookMark to fetch the link from any part of Logos…. for some reason it does not see a system link and I have not had time to go diving to see if I could write a script for HookMark, but that is for another day.
Thanks for keeping links in the design of Logos. They are extremely useful for certain types of workflows.
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> When I click on the note in web app the links open a new tab in browser and then says the Bible Study document cant be viewed, I must download the Logos Desktop app.
That message is a bug which we didn't know existed. We'll get that fixed. Thanks for the report.
It's now fixed.
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@Bradley Grainger (Logos) do you say that after the l4 links have been removed in v39-v40 Will I still be able to add the links manually by typing them in.
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Will I still be able to add the links manually by typing them in.
Yes. If you're typing them in right now, you will still be able to type them in in the future.
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@Bradley Grainger (Logos) this sounds hopeful thank you. What I have noticed is, that when doing a l4 links for Study Document in note document, it opens n brand new Study Document instead of the document the link was created for, and even when you long-press and say open in new tile or left or right nothing happens.
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What's an example link that doesn't function as you would expect?
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When in notes I type text ex Bible Study and then in web app I highlight it en do a hyperlink en then add the logos4:BibleStudyBuilder;title=the name of document. The text get hyperlinked, but in mobile or web app when you select the link it opens a new Bible Study Document instead of the one you created. I cant add a video for you here. But if you can give an email or so I can mail a video.
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logos4:BibleStudyBuilder;title=the name of document
Does this work instead?
logos4:BibleStudyBuilder;title=the_name_of_document
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
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@Andrew Batishko sorry if forgot to put my underscores in the comment, but yes I am using the underscore and that is the way it behaves. It opens the Study Builder but like I say it opens a new a new document.
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Oh, I see. The link in the notes works correctly in the desktop app, but when clicking the link in notes on the web app it opens the desktop app and creates a new document. This a bug with both the refly and logos4 urls, and doesn't seem to be specific to the Bible Study document type.
We'll get a case written up for this bug.
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
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