Logos Available on Torrents

Jerry Bush
Jerry Bush Member Posts: 1,111 ✭✭
edited November 20 in English Forum

While looking around for some (legal) torrents, I searched for Logos just to see. To my disappointment, there were links to some of the high-end packages that Logos offers, as well as huge files of every book available and cracks to unlock them. I will not do that to my favorite company and hope that no one else on here will either.

However, there are also some torrents out there with files created on PBB. I do not want to download those without permission from Logos. Could someone from the company respond either way on this? I do not want to do anything illegal, immoral, or that would hurt Logos.

Also, is there any way we can track these guys and at least ask them to take the pirated stuff down?

Jerry

iMac (2019 model), 3Ghz 6 Core Intel i5, 16gb Ram, Radeon Pro Graphics. 500GB SSD.

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Comments

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    I agree it's a massive shame.

    A while back, Bob wrote about that,What Happens When You Steal a Bible - Logos Bible Software Blog

    I commented on that here: What Happens When You Steal a Bible | Truth is Still Truth

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • Matthew C Jones
    Matthew C Jones Member Posts: 10,295

    I read on the Still Truth site they were seeding a torrent of PBBs.  I think that was just a delivery method they are experimenting with. Nothing illegal about that particular torrent but some would question the wisdom of using the same tools the underbelly of the net uses.

    I thought the Logos licensing system would prevent the pirated stuff but I guess Satan never sleeps. It still seems kind of bizarre to steal Bible software. I can't imagine a saved person enjoying a peaceful conscience using stolen software.

    Logos 7 Collectors Edition

  • Rodney Prickett
    Rodney Prickett Member Posts: 115

    no different, if you think about it, than pirating copies of Christian music cd's and Gaither videos, or churches duplicating print music.

    All is illegal and stealing.

  • John McComb
    John McComb Member Posts: 129 ✭✭

     

    While looking around for some (legal) torrents, I searched for Logos just to see....

    Torrents? What on earth are you guys talking about?

  • Jerry Bush
    Jerry Bush Member Posts: 1,111 ✭✭

    My wife and I were in a Family Christian store Monday. We were looking at some Youth materials. One of them was a book with a CD. Someone had stolen the CD and left the book.

    The store has a security system - those giant things you have to pass through to get out the door. I talked to the store manager for awhile and he said they STILL have problems with theft.

    I was blown away, just as I was with my torrent discovery. I still would like an answer from Logos if it is OK to download the PBB files. I assume it is, but I don't want to do it without an OK.

    Jerry

    iMac (2019 model), 3Ghz 6 Core Intel i5, 16gb Ram, Radeon Pro Graphics. 500GB SSD.

  • Ronald Quick
    Ronald Quick Member Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭

    Here's my thoughts.

    I have used Logos for a little over 2 years and I have been amazed at the number of free software specials that have been offered and the willingness for Logos staff to listen to our concerns and do something about it. (for example transfering licenses).

    Not only would using the software illegally would be stealing, I also think it could be viewed by Logos as a stab in the back given how much they do for us customers.

    I guess I just want Logos to know that even though the illegal software is out there there are many (myself included) who are loyal to Logos.

  • Debra W Bouey
    Debra W Bouey Member Posts: 304 ✭✭

     

    While looking around for some (legal) torrents, I searched for Logos just to see....

    Torrents? What on earth are you guys talking about?

    Brother Jerry, torrents are how most hackers/pirates transmit and download illegal (i.e. "pirated", neither legal nor properly paid for) software such as Photoshop, MicroSoft operating systems, music CDs and DVDs and such ... and now, sadly and sinfully, apparently Bible software, too.

    However, torrent is apparently also utilized to transmit large legal, free software and  other files such as the non-copyrighted and/or copyright expired PBB, Personal Book Builder, Logos files. I assume (not always a wise thing to do where the internet is concerned) this is done because it is a faster and/or more efficient way to transmit large files or multiple files???

    Hope that helps!

    Debra

    Lenovo P72: Intel 8th Gen i7-8750H 6-core, 32GB RAM, 2TB HDD + 1TB Sata SSD, 17.3" FHD 1920x1080, NVIDIA Quadro P600 4GB, Win 10 Pro

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    I still would like an answer from Logos if it is OK to download the PBB files. I assume it is, but I don't want to do it without an OK.

    The PBB files are all freely distributable with the single rule being that I (or anyone) can not make money on them.
    As for the vehicle of Torrent being used to distribute them, I fail to see why the vehicle would be a problem.

    I once heard of a thief who drove a pickup truck to steal an ATM machine. I am not tempted to get rid of my truck for that reason.
    Similarly I understand that most software thieves use computers to run their stolen goods, and many of them burn stolen software onto CD's but that does not mean computers or CD's are somehow tainted by that.

    Bittorrent may in fact be used to distribute stolen goods but it is a completely reliable and legal distribution system. Legitimate companies like FOX, Sega, MTv (yuck), Netgear, Lions Gates films, Paramount pictures and many others use bittorrent to legally distribute their own content.

    Finally, The Libronix PBB standard edition page states:
    “the standard edition of the Libronix Personal Book Builder, which allows free distribution of created resources to other Logos Bible Software users.
    --Personal Book Builder - Standard Edition

    Torrent away. No worries.

    :-)

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    I assume (not always a wise thing to do where the internet is concerned) this is done because it is a faster and/or more efficient way to transmit large files or multiple files???

    That's right Debra. The current load of PBB's hosted on my site mount to multiple gigabytes of data. Bittorrent was actually created to transmit that much data.

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • Debra W Bouey
    Debra W Bouey Member Posts: 304 ✭✭

    Ooops, typo alert. Prior post should have been addressed to John.

    Lenovo P72: Intel 8th Gen i7-8750H 6-core, 32GB RAM, 2TB HDD + 1TB Sata SSD, 17.3" FHD 1920x1080, NVIDIA Quadro P600 4GB, Win 10 Pro

  • Debra W Bouey
    Debra W Bouey Member Posts: 304 ✭✭

    I just use the little "PBB Updater" (works fine with my Vista64) to keep up with my copyright expired, legal PBB Logos files which a generous Logos user over at Still Truth site developed and made freely available to us. Works for me, but then I have a high speed broadband connection and I don't automatically DL every PBB available.

    Thank you for the website, BTW, as well!

    Debra

    Lenovo P72: Intel 8th Gen i7-8750H 6-core, 32GB RAM, 2TB HDD + 1TB Sata SSD, 17.3" FHD 1920x1080, NVIDIA Quadro P600 4GB, Win 10 Pro

  • TCBlack
    TCBlack Member Posts: 10,978

    Thank you for the website, BTW, as well!

    You're welcome!

    Hmm Sarcasm is my love language. Obviously I love you. 

  • Brian Whalen
    Brian Whalen Member Posts: 67 ✭✭

    There are some who are opposed to paying for Christian ministry, perhaps this is their rebellion?

    Brian Whalen

    http://www.mcnazarene.com

  • Paul Golder
    Paul Golder Member Posts: 1,698

    Torrents? What on earth are you guys talking about?

    Torrents are efficient way of distributing large amounts of data. For example if you want to download multiple gigabytes of data form Truth is Still Truth, the download would count against Thomas' account, as well as use a large amount of bandwidth during the download. But with a torrent, Thomas can "seed" it, and after the the first person downloads it, and also "seeds" it,  the second person downloads it from both of them, cutting the download in half from each seeder. As many people begin to "seed" it, the average bandwidth drops more and more. It's like getting a cup of water from a thousand different people, versus getting it all from one tanker truck..

    This is all managed through Bit Torrent software on each machine.

    The problem is that, as stated earlier, it is mostly used for illegal and questionable files. Internet service providers know this, and tend to limit the speed of torrents ( although they will say that they are only limiting high internet traffic, limiting torrents specifically has become illegal )

    .

    "As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

  • Paul Golder
    Paul Golder Member Posts: 1,698

    There are some who are opposed to paying for Christian ministry, perhaps this is their rebellion?

    For the Scripture says: Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain, and, the worker is worthy of his wages.
    1 Timothy 5:18

    Although it would seem that some are more worthy than others, especially in the Christian entertainment industry

    "As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

  • Debra W Bouey
    Debra W Bouey Member Posts: 304 ✭✭

    PAUL-

    Thank you for the very thorough, informative explanation of what torrents are and how they work.

    Debra

    Lenovo P72: Intel 8th Gen i7-8750H 6-core, 32GB RAM, 2TB HDD + 1TB Sata SSD, 17.3" FHD 1920x1080, NVIDIA Quadro P600 4GB, Win 10 Pro

  • John McComb
    John McComb Member Posts: 129 ✭✭

     

    Brother Jerry, torrents are how most hackers/pirates transmit and download illegal (i.e. "pirated", neither legal nor properly paid for) software such as Photoshop, MicroSoft operating systems, music CDs and DVDs and such

    Oh, o.k. thanks, however my name is John. I think brother Jerry already knows what torrents are since he brought it up.

    Man, it's like trying to keep up with adolescent slang. Some years ago I laughed at my young son the first time I saw him sporting his 3 sizes too large trousers dangling so low on his backside that most of his underwear was exposed. Boy, did he ever get mad at me for that. Good thing that I didn't know that it was gang banger, prison fashion or I might have been the one who got mad.

    However, torrent is apparently also utilized to transmit large legal, free software and  other files such as the non-copyrighted and/or copyright expired PBB, Personal Book Builder, Logos files.

    Well sure, why not. It's just software.

    Yours in Christ

    John

  • Debra W Bouey
    Debra W Bouey Member Posts: 304 ✭✭

    JOHN opined:

    "Man, it's like trying to keep up with adolescent slang."

    Indeed!  [;)]

    Lenovo P72: Intel 8th Gen i7-8750H 6-core, 32GB RAM, 2TB HDD + 1TB Sata SSD, 17.3" FHD 1920x1080, NVIDIA Quadro P600 4GB, Win 10 Pro

  • Matthew C Jones
    Matthew C Jones Member Posts: 10,295


    I still would like an answer from Logos if it is OK to download the PBB files. I assume it is, but I don't want to do it without an OK.

    Jerry

    It isn't really a legal issue but a safety question. I would highly recommend you avoid the torrent route and get the PBBs straight from Still Truth or other mirrors. Unless you KNOW your good torrent's hash value and take lots of precautions, you will end up regretting it.  I have cleaned a lot of people's computers of a lot of disgusting and damaging stuff because they used P2P file sharing. Even some files on CNET are infected. One website I scanned had 25% infected Public Domain files. It is just too risky.

    Logos 7 Collectors Edition

  • Matthew C Jones
    Matthew C Jones Member Posts: 10,295

    This is all managed through Bit Torrent software on each machine.

     

    If not properly configured you could unintentionally expose many private files and copyrighted software on your computer to the whole file sharing world. Years ago I received warning from Microsoft that I had my whole MSDN drive in share mode on my computer.

    One way software vendors combat piracy is to seed corrupt torrents to waste time and resources of theives. But the bad guys also seed corrupted torrents that have spyware and porn redirects in them.

    The whole resource sharing idea behind Peer-To-Peer dates back to ADA (a distributed Defense Department operating system.) It is great in theory but when you add evil intent to the mix it becomes a bad day waiting to happen.

    Logos 7 Collectors Edition

  • Bohuslav Wojnar
    Bohuslav Wojnar Member Posts: 3,466 ✭✭✭

    Matthew, thank you. To your both posts I say 100% agreed. The "river" of torrents is so polluted that to fish there is very risky. Anyways, most good and "not contaminated  fish" you can find on other places.

    Bohuslav

  • David Buckham
    David Buckham Member Posts: 549 ✭✭

    Psalm 18:4b NASB

    "And the ​torrents of ​​ungodliness ​terrified me."

    How's that for proof texting?

    all about Christ,
    David

    all about Christ,

    David Buckham

     

  • CopyLeft
    CopyLeft Member Posts: 2

    Citizens of a capitalistic country who live by selling every thought they think, or every word they write, or every thing they make will not understand how "saved" persons enjoy "peaceful conscience" after using "stolen" software. 

    The numerical system you use is the Hindu-Arabic numerical system. Each time you use these numerical symbols, are you paying a license fee to inhabitants of the Arab or Hindu world? The number 0 constitutes half of all digital data. It was invented by an Indian. In other words, half of all digital data (comprising of just zeroes and ones) belong to India. If you decide to pay for it, will you be able to? You make copyright and license laws according to your convenience and impose it on the world. 

    You talk about ownership of songs and lyrics. How much money did you pay David or any of his descendants to use his psalms? How much money did you pay the Jews to use their Hebrew Bible? 

    It is high time you learn from Christians in the developing world. We write songs and give it away. The most famous of our lyricists died in poverty. They never regretted their decision to give away their valuable lyrics to the Church. These songs get translated from one language to the other. No one here is bothered about selling rights to churches or individuals. Similarly, our sermons/books/presentations/magazine articles are available on the internet for free. (There are now some of us who are learning to sell each sermon or song; they too are now learning from you to say that they "own" their works).

    How do you think a person in the Majority World can pay $500 or $800 for a Christian software or a set of commentary? There may be just a handful of Christians here who can afford to do so. Most evangelists and pastors in India live on $60 a month! Buying a PC (The Mac - your favorite machine - is way too expensive for us) is like buying a Merc. After we save up and buy a PC, we are left with no money to buy software. Yet, you do not offer a reduced rate for ministers or students from the Majority World. We can't afford your software. At the same time, we can't afford to be in the dark. When you light a candle with another candle, the first candle doesn't lose any of it's flame.

     It's easy to preach about the boy who gave up his lunch so that Jesus could feed the five thousand. Would you have done it, if you were in that boy's place, without signing a contract to receive royalty for each loaf and fish that Jesus created?

  • DominicM
    DominicM Member Posts: 2,995 ✭✭✭

    GRR - this is why we should lock old threads -  previous last post is Sat, Sep 12 2009 11:54 PM

    Phillip,  Logos (to my knowledge) always has given the engine freely, its only he resources we wish to have, we pay for.

    Even in the third/developing world, those with the resouces (food, skills) exchange/sell them for a fee or barter them in excange for food etc they are rarely given away totally free.. I am sorry but Logos has noting to do with how the publishers choose to distribute their goods, and how much they demand in royalies per copy sold..

    There are several Good free alternatives out there should you be not in a position to afford Logos, this is a Logos forum so I wont post the link but if you search for "The Word" you will likely find something that may fill your need, but  if you NEED Logos, God has a mysterious way of providing for our needs,  he will make it happen if he wants you to have it..

    Never Deprive Anyone of Hope.. It Might Be ALL They Have

  • Matthew C Jones
    Matthew C Jones Member Posts: 10,295

    Citizens of a capitalistic country

    Citizens of a socialist country are accustomed to receiving free handouts of lesser quality The capitalists also provide some free Bible software, if that is what you are asking for. In the book of Ruth we see Boaz harvests his crops, leaving just the gleanings for the poor. In the book of Acts Peter tells Ananias and Sapphira their land and money were theirs to do with as they pleased. They died for lying to the Holy Spirit, not for keeping their money back.

    If you can steal to meet your needs without a guilty conscience, why should God bother blessing you? He already knows you will satisfy your desires by theft and don't need Him........

    God loves a cheerful giver. Nobody likes to be stolen from. not even God. Malachi 3:10

    I know of a source in കേരളം that will provide you many commentaries and Christian study materials in software for FREE. I don't think they give away computers, though.

    Logos 7 Collectors Edition

  • Jacob Hantla
    Jacob Hantla MVP Posts: 3,871

    If it wasn't for capitalism, I'd be reading my printed Bible (maybe) and be praising God for it. But capitalism and the possibility of a profit coupled with a love for God and His Word drove Bob Pritchett to devote his life and risk an incredible amount on the venture that became Logos Bible Software and culminated in the software that we enjoy. Nothing wrong with paying. The laborer deserves his wages.

    Thanks, Logos

    Jacob Hantla
    Pastor/Elder, Grace Bible Church
    gbcaz.org

  • Paul Golder
    Paul Golder Member Posts: 1,698

    I love when an old thread gets resurrected...[;)]

    Point of fact:

    • I deserve nothing from no one. 
    • If someone makes, builds, writes, or in any other way creates something that he or she deems of value, no one (regardless of the product produced) has any right to say what is a fair or unfair price for it.
    • If someone is selling something, and I think that the price is what I'm willing to pay, I buy it. If I think that it is too high, I don't buy it.

    Now granted, modern philosophical thought will most assuredly disagree with the first two points, but then again, modern philosophical thought would think us fools for desiring Bible software in the first place.

    "As any translator will attest, a literal translation is no translation at all."

  • CopyLeft
    CopyLeft Member Posts: 2

    @Paul Golder,

    Point taken. But in the usual sense of the word, when I "buy" something, I own it and I can do whatever I want to do with it. It's none of the seller's business to find out what I do with a product that I buy. Imposing conditions that curtail a buyer's freedom doesn't seem right to me. If after "selling" the software, the software still belongs to the seller, then, let's not talk of "buying" and "selling."

    @Super Tramp: "Handout" in a capitalistic country is fashionably called "[trillion dollar] government bail out." But it's still is a handout.

    Sorry for "resurrecting" an old forum. I am putting this back to sleep. Bye!

     

  • Matthew C Jones
    Matthew C Jones Member Posts: 10,295

    But in the usual sense of the word, when I "buy" something, I own it and I can do whatever I want to do with it.

    The problem here is with your misunderstanding of the relationship between users and the software companies. You are not buying the software. You are purchasing an "End User License Agreement" that entitles you to use the software conditionally.

    Consider the recent purchase of QuickVerse by WordSearch and then WordSearch/QuickVerse by LifeWay. When ownership changes hands so does the decision making power. For the moment, LifeWay has stated they will retain the WordSearch staff and keep the QuickVerse software line alive.  Purchasing ownership of the Logos software costs a lot more than your EULA.  You will know you own Logos when you have the power to hire a new CEO, cancel all Pre-Pubs you don't agree with, and give the software away for free.  Until then your compliance will be governed by your conscience (maybe,) the government (possibly,) and God (definitely.)

    Philip P Eapen said:"Handout" in a capitalistic country is fashionably called "[trillion dollar] government bail out."

    Don't blame capitalism for "trillion-dollar-handouts."  Government cradle-to-grave provision is something our current society learned from Marx. Check out these two Logos resources to learn more:
    1. Why Government Can't Save You  by John MacArthur
    2. Seven Men Who Rule the World from the Grave  by Dave Breese

    (for the rest of us: Just view an EULA like a drivers license that does not expire. You don't own the highway, you just get to use it conditionally. [au])

    Logos 7 Collectors Edition

  • Gabriel Smit
    Gabriel Smit Member Posts: 10

    ...there is none that seeketh after God.

    rom 3 11

    no use us comparing sinners with sinners in a vain attempt to get a 'one-upmanship' feeling to stroke our own pride - as if i am by nature closer to God than hitler - the only way to get to the Father is well known to us (john 14 6), as long as we are not in Christ, we are all hellbound - guaranteed!

    God bless

    g

    Rom 8:1 "There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."