The Message of the Old Testament: Promises Made - Issues with Bible Verse Hyperlinks and Table of Co

Mark and Alabama if I was unfair in my comments in anyway towards you please accept my apology, that was not my intent. I just didn't find on this occasion you hit the mark in term of providing comment that was going to lead to satisfactory resolution of this issue.

Mark Barnes said:

Andrew Mckenzie said:

Vyrso is Logos.  They sell books and the price point on the basis of integration into Logos Library.

I think you've misunderstood the purpose of Vyrso. The main purpose of Vyrso is not Logos integration, but the offering of Christian e-books to the general public. That's why there's a dedicated Vyrso app, and a dedicated Vyrso store. Logos integration is a bonus that (normally) persuades Logos users to buy, but it's not the raison d'etre.

Mark I haven't misunderstood.  I am clear they are not of the standard of Logos books.  I am not asking for full milestones or indexing which it would be nice in some of these books, all I am asking is for bible hyperlinks to work correctly at this point in time.  I don't think that is a standard too high for a Vyrso book.   If a non Logos use buys one of these books and then decides they want a bible to check the references - they are in for a very rude shock and a very poor impression of both Vyrso and Logos and less likely to become a regular repeat customer and their word of mouth testimony about what is being offered under the label Vyrso is likely to be poor also amongst their circle of influence. My concern extends not just to my personal usability but to the name of Logos and Vyrso and their reputation in the marketplace.  

The table of contents I can live with as is but felt the issue should be also highlighted because as I showed  in my screenshot the title is there in the resource, the tagging is simply closed off too quickly for the title to be picked up, if there was not chapter title than so be it.  

Mark Barnes said:

What we're trying to do here is simply be honest with you, and reflect back what has already been said on the subject over the last year. We're not saying "this isn't an issue, be quiet about it", we're saying "here's our understanding of Logos' intentions and policies". The issues you're raising have come up several times before, particularly when Vyrso was first launched.

Mark I know the issue has come up before and it needs to continually be brought up until Vyrso and Logos get the message poor quality in basic things like bible hyperlinks is not acceptable.  Knowing the comments Logos makes, having MVP's simply restate Logos policy in a way that sounds like the agree with it only makes Logos think they have made the right policy decisions.  I appreciate it can be find links to previous statements by Logos staff and apologize for being unfair to you.  I simply do not accept Vyrso books are at an acceptable standard when it comes to bible hyperlinks.

On the front page of Vyrso they clearly state Vyrso books work with Logos 4 and Biblia.  When there are endemic errors in a resource with bible hyperlinks I don't believe that claim is being lived up to and would be confusing to users who you are suggesting Vyrso is targeting.  I am only further compelled by this line of thought when I look at the  "What is Vyrso?" page on the Vyrso website.   It states the following:

To make such a bold claim bible hyperlinks in Vyrso books must point to the correct scripture references.

And if there is still any doubt about what I am suggesting in Vyrso not meeting their own standards and the expectation that they have put out to customers in terms of the functionality of these resources then surely this following claim also from the "What is Vyrso?" web page is enough to re-enforce as a customer my expectation of Vyrso is not too high in this instance.

Right now the Vyrso book I have raised the issue about, probably its New Testament companion and numerous other Vyrso books similar to these are not living up to this claim above.  I don't believe Logos intended this to mean you would get random pop-ups to any scripture dependent upon the luck of the draw of  their book compiler, but you would get a pop-up to the correct scripture, at least that's what the blurb and image suggest.  Or maybe they've just used the same marketing as McDonalds and Burger King where the advertisement always look's better than what you actually get in real life.

The ball is now Vyrso / Logos court.  I have not doubt of the integrity of Logos and Vyrso and the people who work there which is why I am strongly pointing out they should not make a marketing claim and then say because of a company policy we can not to live up to that claim, or it's too expensive to meet that claim about their product.  I restate my original premise:  Vyrso needs basic quality checking to ensure bible hyperlinks work correctly.

alabama24 said:

Secondly, every single one of the topics you have addressed I believe HAVE been addressed by Logos employees, including Bob Pritchett. Since I read these forums so much (especially mobile & Vyrso), I have a greater memory about these things. What Mark told you about cost margins is the basic argument. The books are auto processed and having a human checker would 1) make the books cost prohibitive and 2) would seriously delay the release of the works. I would rather not have either of those results.

Alabama I'll give you the benefit of the doubt you did not read closely my last response as you were getting ready for church, but the simple fact is Logos HAVE NOT addressed these issues I raised.  They HAVE MADE EXCUSES.  It's time to call a spade a spade, this is not a hyperbole.   My last post clearly demonstrates the claim that bible hyperlinks work in VYRSO books.  And your continual defeding of the company by bringing up statments made in the past where they have made excuses for not meeting what they are advertising is only digging a deeper hole, if that's possible at this point.  If you had of respected my orginal post for what it was I probably wouldn't have been driven to point out how deeply Logos is doing the wrong thing here, But you felt it necessary to whitewash Logos/Vyrso lack of action on this issue.

I appreciate Logos and the tools and resources I have access to through them, and don't like having to make posts like this, but I am a customer of a service they are providing it to me, and so I don't wear Logos coloured glasses and I don't accept it when they make claims they are not meeting.  Maybe advertising law in US is different but Logos would be in serious trouble in my country if they came up with these excuses for not meeting the claims they are making about the Vyrso product. 

MJ. Smith said:

You know there is a simple solution to this problem: If a resource does not meet your expectations and needs, return it. Enough returns and the publisher will do something about it. Bickering over the interpretation of what Logos has said is one adverse side-effect of using Logos - the scholars are always bickering about interpretation in their work

MJ I appreciate your intent with your comment but it's a red herring. This is not bickering, its a serious issue.  And its not the publisher's issue.  Logos under the Vyrso label is making the claim, not the publisher. They have made a claim about the standard of resources they are producing and are not meeting that standard.  E4 standard resources is not the claim they make about the Vyrso product. If I just buried my head in the sand, put on Logos coloured glasses and swept this under the carpet and simply asked for a refund the probelm would still remain not only in this resource but every other resource where this issue exists because Logos are not quality checking their work on Vyrso books to ensure they are meeting their marketing claims to the customer.  I can not simply close my eyes and pretend this is not happeing. This impacts not just me but every customer who reads the claims of their webstie and is been given a false expectation.

I am not griping to other users.  It is other user who keep telling me I am wrong for not being satisfied with the situation, who keep putting me in the position of continually having to re-inforce their are clear claims on the Vyrso webiste that are not being met.  If they stop, then I wont' have further need to respond.  

 I have put my concerns for the Vyrso team here.  Despite yoru belief they dont' read these forums, they do and regularly respond to issues raised here. If you don't share my depth of concern that is fine, I am not asking your or anyonelse too.  That does not give anyone a right to tell me I should not post about my concern. This is not a gripe.  This is a issue of truth in advertising that I am raising.  If you don't get that don't call it griping.  Just move on to the the next thread.

MJ. Smith said:

Andrew Mckenzie said:

MJ I appreciate your intent with your comment but it's a red herring.

It is no kind of fish - it is a polite attempt to make the point that griping to other users does nothing to further your cause. I've agreed that your issue is just - so take it up with Logos not Logos users.Logos users can't fix the problem, they can only "vote" with their purchases or lack thereof.