Official: Minimum Crossgrade and free engine download are coming!

Bob,

Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Even though I am one of those who has experienced numerous prepub releases at the same time (this is going to happen again in about 10 days), Logos is not responsible for placing my orders - I am.  And as much as I wish there would be a gradual release of prepubs, it's impossible for Logos to develop a release schedule when so many different customers place so many different orders.  One month I may have no prepubs shipped when someone else has many.

So - I appreciate the time and effort Logos takes to work with each customer.

By the way, I have talked to customer service and we have already worked out a plan for me to afford my prepubs.

Another happy customer!

PS.  I am patiently waiting for the Crossgrade so I can play with Logos 5 too.

Thanks again,

Ron

Hey, Dan Cousins,

Thanks for calling us into prayer, and for the prayer you offered. [:)]

I do hope that at the very least Logos will keep the intro pricing up until the cross-grade can launch; otherwise we'll have no way to compare pricing. I'm also curious if I upgrade to a lower base package if the % discount on the higher ones vanishes (eg, if I pay more to upgrade to broze then to silver than if I went directly to silver).

So, right now I can upgrade to Starter for $48, and Bronze for $226. If I get Starter today can I buy Bronze for $178 tomorrow, or will the discount on Bronze be less so the total would be more than the $228 I'd have paid for it initially?

Thanks!

Robin,

I would suggest that you give the good folks at Logos a call first thing tomorrow when they are open.  They are quite reasonable and if you voice your concerns over this, they might be willing to make arrangements with you regarding all of this uncertainty.  If you spend a certain amount of time going over the lists of things you will get with this new version, start with the package that is going to give you the largest discount.  It may be more than you want to spend, but go through the lists of stuff.  Most of it to me is beyond my skill level, and although useful at some point, I couldn't really see the value of owning of it.  Then I found some commentaries and devotional resources like the works of Baxter and Tozer.  Here's a helpful hint in your decision making progress.  When they give you a price for a resource, cut that price in half.  You know that they are going to put that on sale at some point.  You just have to be patient and wait for it.  If you can add up a number that comes pretty close to equating to the price they are asking about 100 dollars short, then you should probably just do it.  I say 100 dollars short as the minimal crossgrade is going to cost you something.  We don't know for sure what that is, but I would venture to say it is probably around the 100 dollar mark.  If it turns out to be 50 or 150, you are still only 50 dollars off in your calculation.  Personally, I think it is the only way in which you can justify the expense of a large amount of money is by pulling certain things out of the huge list that really speak to you.  Now, if you manage to talk yourself into the larger process and just can't manage to push yourself into the pool... ask your sales person if there is any way to buy into the lower package and test the waters a bit and still be able to get that special price on that bigger package  a week or two down the road.  All they can do is to say no and then you know you will have to jump now or lose that 15-30 percent discount.  The lists of stuff you have to wade through is pretty intimidating.  I think that if you concentrate on picking out the things that you really like in the list and with the big ticket items like commentaries and such, using half the price they give you as a guide will help you.  I am sure somebody in sales will be groaning at the half price thing but really, even with that, you will find that the dollars will really add up quick.  If you can't get the dollar amount at one level, drop to the next one and try there.  You will find a happy spot where you can feel good about what you are getting and end up with some really cool resources that you really like and will use.  Along with that will be a whole slug of other stuff that you might or might not make use of.  Forget about that part and just concentrate on the things that you know you will cherish and use over the years to come.  :-)   If you can't afford it all right  now, do the payment plan thing. 
I hope that helps you, then again, it might just have wrapped your head around the proverbial light pole. 
God Bless!

Robin Monks said:

I do hope that at the very least Logos will keep the intro pricing up until the cross-grade can launch; otherwise we'll have no way to compare pricing. I'm also curious if I upgrade to a lower base package if the % discount on the higher ones vanishes (eg, if I pay more to upgrade to broze then to silver than if I went directly to silver).

So, right now I can upgrade to Starter for $48, and Bronze for $226. If I get Starter today can I buy Bronze for $178 tomorrow, or will the discount on Bronze be less so the total would be more than the $228 I'd have paid for it initially?

 

Thanks!

In my experience, upgrading in L4 from Scholar's to Silver to Platinum, I paid a bit more for it because I did it in steps like that.  I don't remember the exact amount, but I recall that it was more than I expected.  (I am guessing it cost me $100 more, or so, because I upgraded this way.)  Buy the most expensive package you can afford, for the best discount.

Great, very helpful, satisfying post, we love logos, thank you for all the hard work you are doing to make our bible study easier and more fun.

Robin Monks said:

One more question to those who've made the jump to 5: will it overwrite 4 or install along side of it, and will it use existing resources I downloaded or re-download my entire library?

5 overwrites 4 and uses the same resources. However, there is still a big download because many resources were rebuilt for L5.

Rick King said:

Here's a helpful hint in your decision making progress.  When they give you a price for a resource, cut that price in half.  You know that they are going to put that on sale at some point.  You just have to be patient and wait for it.  If you can add up a number that comes pretty close to equating to the price they are asking about 100 dollars short, then you should probably just do it. 

Using this method I ended with with in the neighborhood of $1200 of things I actually wanted for $420; so I grabbed the Silver package. Thanks for the tip

Christopher Sanchez said:

I completed my upgrade yesterday as planned and am quite happy with the new interface and the resources I received (Silver to Silver).  Now I am making my plans to move on up to Gold.

I couldn't find the same value in Gold; but, maybe there'll be some Black Friday/Christmas/March special that'll make it unbearably attractive. I was using the Scholar’s Library before moving to Silver (which is presently downloading). I was able to originally get the Lender's Library at a significant discount thanks in part to finding some Libronix CDs in a discount software bin at a local retailer :P, then I jumped to Lender's Library during a massive sale. So far Logos has been one of the best investments I've made.

Hi Bob,

I just checked on my upgrade discount calculator and it shows that Believers Church Bible Commentary (24 vols) is new to me while I already own this particular set and shows up in my library.  I really don't have the time to go through every set and every volume I have to see if that has been configured into the discount to come up with a price for me in order for me to upgrade either to Platinum, or Diamond or Portfolio.  Is the tool working properly and if it is, then the page is not posting that correctly.  I am quite frustrated with this as you can see.  An unjust scale is an abomination to the Lord.  Scripture says that we should rather choose to be defrauded than to defraud someone knowingly or unwittingly.  I am not giving up on Logos nor on your team.  I want to you do what is right and that the information that is given is done right.  Provide all things honest in the sight of all men is the admonition of the Scriptures.

In Christ Alone and for His Glory

Naveen

Psalm 119:9-11

Ted Weis said:

When I clicked on the link for my personal calculator for a Logos 5 price, I found that the calculator accurately sifted out what I had with what I didn't have--except for the 40 volume New American Commentary series (NAC).

I doubt it'll lower my price significantly to lure me to buy a package, but just relaying info to those interested.

At this stage, I think I'm waiting for the opportunity to get Logos 5 engine and features, without adding any new books.

Ted the NAC shows up if you own any NAC volumes, but calculates it based on the number. When I got L4 Platinum it came with volumes of the NAC but it wasn't 40. So it would show NAC on the upgrade page but only charge for 40 - the number already owned.

Bill, you are correct. You will keep your current resources.

Bill Moore said:

Hi Rick. What I wrote must have been a bit muddled. I know that I will keep my resources. I was just saying that the minimum crossgrade is essentially a program upgrade from what I understand, moving from version 4 to version 5.

More like the minimum needed to get access to the new stuff listed in http://www.logos.com/features without adding any unneccessary new resources. A direct program upgrade will supposedly be free, but will be missing most of the cooler new features because you wouldn't have the data sets.

There are still some rendering bugs in Logos 5 on Windows 8 as well (scrolling a resources sometimes causes the left 200px to become stuck in place and out of sync), but many fewer than with Logos 4 (clicking on a tab opens the previous tab you clicked instead of the tab you actually clicked in resource views). So, waiting a while might get some additional bugs ironed out as well.

Bill Moore said:

Hi Rick. What I wrote must have been a bit muddled. I know that I will keep my resources. I was just saying that the minimum crossgrade is essentially a program upgrade from what I understand, moving from version 4 to version 5.

Essentially the engine download is that. The crossgrade as it is sometimes called contains some of the features.

Robin Monks said:

Bill Moore said:

Hi Rick. What I wrote must have been a bit muddled. I know that I will keep my resources. I was just saying that the minimum crossgrade is essentially a program upgrade from what I understand, moving from version 4 to version 5.

More like the minimum needed to get access to the new stuff listed in http://www.logos.com/features without adding any unneccessary new resources. A direct program upgrade will supposedly be free, but will be missing most of the cooler new features because you wouldn't have the data sets.

 

There are still some rendering bugs in Logos 5 on Windows 8 as well (scrolling a resources sometimes causes the left 200px to become stuck in place and out of sync), but many fewer than with Logos 4 (clicking on a tab opens the previous tab you clicked instead of the tab you actually clicked in resource views). So, waiting a while might get some additional bugs ironed out as well.

Hi Robin. I was thinking about other computer programs which are upgraded to the "next" level, e.g. BibleWorks and even WORDsearch. There is usually a charge to move up to the newly released upgrade, and I think that is proper. Whether L5 qualifies as an upgrade or not, I do not know, though I suspect it does. I do not yet have L5 and am not curious enough right now to work through the videos and forum posts to see what's new.

I will say that, while I understand the need to make things better, the continual upgrading of programs wearies me. I realize that it's been three years since L4 was released, and three years is akin to a couple of centuries when it comes to technology [;)], but it seems like I get fairly comfortable with one release when the next one comes around the bend.

Sometimes I'm confused as to whether I am working the software or the software is working me. When so much is at one's disposal, it takes effort to slow down and digest and meditate upon what one is reading.

redacted

Bill Moore said:

I understand how Logos is using its terminology. I was relating, perhaps incorrectly, the entire engine download/minimum crossgrade to what other software companies would call their program upgrade.

Robert Iversen said:

I would keep paying for an outdated and replaced product.

Actually, you'll be paying for a product that is better than you knew when you bought it. You'll get L5 when you thought you were only buying L4. You just need to wait a little while for the free engine to become available first.

As for the package content, if you compare what you have with some L5 package and decide the L5 one would suit you better, give Sales a call, and they might let you switch, depending on how long you've had it. Just remember you'd lose any resources that are in the old package but not the new.

Robert Iversen said:

Bob,

As a new customer who is still in my time frame of making monthly payments to be able to afford this software (spending over $600), this upgrade gives me the disappointing feeling that I should have waited.  I feel like I do when I bought my iPad 3 weeks before the new model came out and was stuck with a significantly inferior product.  This seems very disappointing to me, a new customer, just joining the Logos family.  I feel overlooked.

I don't think that's fair. How many months in are you? Did you buy 2 months ago? 4 months ago? If it's sooner - call them. Like you should have done with your iPad, since Apple has a 30 day return policy and you could have switched it out. By the way, the iPad 3 like Logos 4 is far from a "significantly inferior product". Both were replaced by newer products, but both are fantastic. I should know... I have the iPad 3, and up until a couple of days ago, I had Logos 4.

The good news, is you can keep using Logos 4. Soon you get Logos 5, for free, with limited new functionality, for a small crossgrade fee, for lots of new functionality, or if you want tons of new features and new content, you can tack on a new base package to your existing payment plan. 

But you are decidedly not being asked to keep paying for an outdated and replaced product. You are on an installment plan. You spent the $XXX already, but they agreed to defer some of the payments. If you had done this on a credit card, rather than a Logos payment plan, it'd be the same. You'd still be paying off your purchase. My car is now two years out of date, and the newer model is superior in many ways. They even introduced some new features that I wish I could get, such as a hybrid engine as an option. I still pay monthly, for what I already have, however.

Soon, you'll see this happen again. The iPad 5 will be out. Logos 6 will be out. There will be nicer cars than mine.

I purchased the Silver upgrade which does not include the Bible Sense Lexicon (did not have enough money to buy the Gold version).  Will this be available to me to purchase at a reasonable price separately down the road so I have all the new L5 features?

Tim Engwer said:

I purchased the Silver upgrade which does not include the Bible Sense Lexicon (did not have enough money to buy the Gold version).  Will this be available to me to purchase at a reasonable price separately down the road so I have all the new L5 features?