Introducing Faithlife Connect

Matthew, I have an ask to check on this. I'm sorry you haven't received any communication yet. I'll make sure to circle back on this when I find out something. You may be on a special email list that's coming directly from Customer Service as we had some customers with unique situations that we had to manually migrate and do special things for. You may be on that list. Thanks for your patience, my hope is you'll have closure sometime today. 

Thank you Chris.

Like most (at least from what I can see) I wasn't happy with the changes but if there is anything I've learned thus far in life is to wait it out and evaluate later.  I snatched up the course on Exodus temporarily and I'm excited to dive into that.  As you mentioned, I'll wait until January and see how it goes.

Yes, you definitely have some time to sort out what you want to do moving forward, and I'm glad you're taking advantage of the additional benefits that come in Connect! 

In my mind "all Logos Now benefits" means: 1) Members' Only offers; 2) Discounts on Libraries and Feature Sets; 3) Access to Logos-selected Mobile Ed course; 4) Free "classic" book each month; 5) Access to preview resources; 6) Logos 8 early release features.

That's correct. 

If this is the case, what would be the point in paying for Faithlife Connect Starter while I'm still enjoying these benefits?

You would receive additional benefits that come in Connect, such as Faithlife Courses and Faithlife TV. When 11/12/18 comes, you will still have access to some of the Logos Now benefits that come as part of Connect Starter, ie, exclusive discounts on select products and Libraries and Feature Sets; access to preview resources, etc. 

Very disappointed with this move by Faithlife. Like many, I only want the feature set (though the free books were nice) and for that reason I am considering canceling my Faithlife Connect subscription. 

Presumably, I'll still have access to LN features until nov 2018 even if I cancel my FC Starter subscription?

Edit: personally I would have preferred this to work the other way around. Keep LN alive until Nov 2018 at $8.99 per month, provide LN members complimentary access to FC Essentials for free until then. And then allow us to decided it is worth the increased price. It isn't like we haven't tested new features before general rollout before (web app anyone...). Oh well.

if there is anything I've learned thus far in life is to wait it out and evaluate later. 

I think that there is a lot of wisdom in what you are saying.

Presumably, I'll still have access to LN features until nov 2018 even if I cancel my FC Starter subscription?

That's correct. And you still can use your promo code to use on a library or feature set, or upgrade to a Connect Essentials subscription if you like. 

That's correct. And you still can use your promo code to use on a library or feature set, or upgrade to a Connect Essentials subscription if you like. 

Thanks, Chris. Really appreciate all your quick answers on this post.

Can't help but think you've got the worst deal here. Who did you annoy at Faithlife to be lumbered with this 'poison chalice' announcement? I hope you are getting a raise for this... :-)

Still waiting on an email Chris duMond.

No problem, happy to help. 

I'll check on this, DOC. Stay tuned. 

All this makes my head hurt. When Logos 7 came out we were told that Logos had a great deal for us. Logos Now would be the latest and greatest thing since Erasmus. I bit because I figured if Logos was going to ask me to upgrade every two years, paying $89 per year was cheaper. Well, the latest and greatest lasted less than two years and now I am faced with much greater costs. But now, if I decide to be rid of these schemes, I will have to upgrade to the permanent software. But, because I chose Logos Now instead of upgrading to 7, I will have to upgrade to 8 from Logos 6, correct? How much more will upgrading from 6 be than upgrading from 7?

Can you also assist me in resending my email? I seemed to have lost or not gotten one. Thanks!

This is an utter betrayal.

The product being offered appeals only to a limited subset of the population that isn't growing rapidly. In order to increase revenues they either have to change that or increase prices.

Supply and Demand will find a new equilibrium point and future decisions will be based on whether or not that equilibrium provides the desired revenue.

I ended my auto renewal today to provide immediate feedback and because I found $99 was an appropriate price for the features I used the most, free book, web app, and discounts. I spent $6.7k on orders since 2016.

I was told I can't switch my membership to Verbum Now which would provide the benefits I use the most at an appropriate price for me.

When my Logos Now runs out in September if I find miss those features enough I will start a Verbum Now subscription. Depending on what features you use the most, that might also be a viable alternative to others. Verbum Now is not supposed to convert to Faithlife and it is $99 a month unless that gets increased also at the same time Faithlife Connect takes over.

Can you also assist me in resending my email? I seemed to have lost or not gotten one. Thanks!

I'll check on this for you. 

But, because I chose Logos Now instead of upgrading to 7, I will have to upgrade to 8 from Logos 6, correct? How much more will upgrading from 6 be than upgrading from 7?

Two steps at a time would hurt, but we don't know how much until L8 is available. Just upgrade to L7 Full Feature Set and wait (your LN will continue until November 12 if it would normally expire before then).

Like others I subscribed to LN for features and updates and was happy to help pay for the development of the software. But with Faith connect I have no interest in Faithlife TV, Logos Cloud, or Faithlife Ebooks.  I’m disappointed that it seems an all or nothing deal. So with that in mind I will not renew my subscription and purchase the features that I don’t have and let it go at that. I hope that Logos 8 is not moving toward in all subsciptions model. Owning the tools of my trade is important to me.

Well said, I invested in Logos Now for the same reasons. I felt like a member. Not anymore.

Phil (and Chris),

In reading these various threads about Faithlife Connect, it seems that there are quite a few Logos Now subscribers who approached it the same way I did. LN at $99/yr was a good value because it assured that I would always have all the Logos (desktop) features even across major version upgrades. In the past, I would spend more than $300 on version upgrades because I was forced to buy some level of library to get the new version's features. With LN, I could always have the features. I have ~10K resources - I don't need more books. I didn't care about any of the other LN benefits: courses, resources, etc. I only cared about the application features (which includes datasets needed by those features).

Now I look at https://connect.faithlife.com/now-connect-compare and see that half of the features/datasets I had in LN are going away if I stick with "Starter." If I want to keep the features, I've got to pay ~2.5x what I was paying for LN, even though I don't want any of the other "benefits" of Faithlife Connect. If you keep with a 2 year version upgrade cycle, if I can get all new major version features for < $480, I'm better off w/o Connect. It's simply ridiculous and presumptuous pricing. Am I owed an ongoing LN subscription and features at $99/yr? No. But there was certainly an implicit promise made by Faithlife to its customers about the ongoing value and benefits of LN which has been ripped out from under us.

I evaluate the value of subscription models based on how long-term pricing compares to the purchase model. For example, I subscribe to Office 365 at $99 / year. This is a great value because previously I would spend $300 or more every 3 years on Office upgrades, and with the subscription I get 5 licenses. LN was clearly a good long-term value. Connect "Essentials" isn't. And "Starter" takes away features I'd had access to.

From my point of view, there's one thing FL could do to make this pill easier to swallow: For major version upgrades, provide a way to purchase all the new features and datasets in the upgrade without having to buy any kind of a library or resource package - *** on day one of the new version ***. That way I'm assured of access to the new features without having to buy new books, which I don't need.

Thanks for reading,

Donnie

This would be interesting, but you can already get that simply by switching to Verbum Now. So I think what you want is already available.

Bingo...I would be happy if they made a "features" level that didn't have any books or courses and cost $8.25/mo ($99/year). 

That is what I am after - definitely don't want Cloud...

Still waiting on an email Chris duMond.

Me Too ... [:O]

That may be Chris' opinion or more than likely Faithlife's hope. The question becomes helpful to whom? It won't change the email to either of the recipients so I can't see where it harms them. In fact it introduces transparency into how Faithlife rolls out new products so I think it is beneficial to the customers. 

I figured it was only a matter of time before the initial $89.99 annual subscription for LN increased, but I didn’t anticipate how quickly it would happen.  All is not lost though.  The way I see it, I have spent $189.99 for two years on LN that will get me covered through November 2018.  The announcement email states we will be getting a $200 coupon.  So I can use the coupon, purchase the full feature set, cancel the subscription service, and then it will be like Faithlife gave me $10 to try LN for 2 years.

$200 coupon? I guess it's based on the number of years of subscription you've purchased from LN. Mine reads:

"We’re not quite ready to announce a release date for Logos 8, but when it comes, you’ll save $100."

As Chris mentioned, "sharing emails with anyone would not be helpful, as it's specific to each customer."

I was told I can't switch my membership to Verbum Now which would provide the benefits I use the most at an appropriate price for me.

This is not my understanding as I believe you can - See https://community.logos.com/forums/t/160492.aspx?PageIndex=7

That may be Chris' opinion or more than likely Faithlife's hope. The question becomes helpful to whom? It won't change the email to either of the recipients so I can't see where it harms them. In fact it introduces transparency into how Faithlife rolls out new products so I think it is beneficial to the customers. 

I figured it was only a matter of time before the initial $89.99 annual subscription for LN increased, but I didn’t anticipate how quickly it would happen.  All is not lost though.  The way I see it, I have spent $189.99 for two years on LN that will get me covered through November 2018.  The announcement email states we will be getting a $200 coupon.  So I can use the coupon, purchase the full feature set, cancel the subscription service, and then it will be like Faithlife gave me $10 to try LN for 2 years.

$200 coupon? I guess it's based on the number of years of subscription you've purchased from LN. Mine reads:

"We’re not quite ready to announce a release date for Logos 8, but when it comes, you’ll save $100."

As Chris mentioned, "sharing emails with anyone would not be helpful, as it's specific to each customer."

I think what's meant here is that if I send you my email that says I get a discount of $600 (hypothetical, of course) it wouldn't help you because if you're username isn't setup to use that code, it won't work for you.  And if you sent me your email with a coupon code for $200, it wouldn't work on my username since I'm not in the group that can use that code.

Currently, there are coupon codes for Logos Now users.  You can't give those codes to non- Logos Now users and then it work to get a discount.

Still waiting on an email Chris duMond.

Me Too ... 

I'll check into it. We're still sending emails manually to some customers who had special circumstances that we had to treat individually. Thanks for you patience. We should have all emails out today. 

Why?

What difference does the name make if you get all the new features just like you are requesting?

We currently have no plans to discontinue Verbum Now and will not be transitioning Verbum Now customers into Faithlife Connect.

I want that, but for Logos Now.

-Donnie

That may be Chris' opinion or more than likely Faithlife's hope. The question becomes helpful to whom? It won't change the email to either of the recipients so I can't see where it harms them. In fact it introduces transparency into how Faithlife rolls out new products so I think it is beneficial to the customers.

You're welcome to share your emails if you like. It just [probably?] won't be helpful to another person if they're in a different category and have been transitioned into something different than what you have.

I was told I can't switch my membership to Verbum Now which would provide the benefits I use the most at an appropriate price for me.

This is not my understanding as I believe you can - See https://community.logos.com/forums/t/160492.aspx?PageIndex=7

Actually this has been clarified on another thread, you can only switch to Verbum Now at the end of your Logos Now subscription expiration:

https://community.logos.com/forums/p/160523/957141.aspx#957141

[:D]

Thanks for the clarification that its the codes that were referred to not the email itself. I couldn't figure out why knowing there were different coupons for different customers would matter one way or another. Everyone has favored customers.

That may be Chris' opinion or more than likely Faithlife's hope. The question becomes helpful to whom? It won't change the email to either of the recipients so I can't see where it harms them. In fact it introduces transparency into how Faithlife rolls out new products so I think it is beneficial to the customers.

You're welcome to share your emails if you like. It just [probably?] won't be helpful to another person if they're in a different category and have been transitioned into something different than what you have.

I was told I can't switch my membership to Verbum Now which would provide the benefits I use the most at an appropriate price for me.

This is not my understanding as I believe you can - See https://community.logos.com/forums/t/160492.aspx?PageIndex=7

Actually this has been clarified on another thread, you can only switch to Verbum Now at the end of your Logos Now subscription expiration:

https://community.logos.com/forums/p/160523/957141.aspx#957141

Thanks for pointing out that thread and for the clarification.

Please reconsider offering LN separately from Faithlife Connect. We really don't care to pay extra to rent books, courses, and TV. Thanks!

exactly my thoughts. 

[Y] +1

I'll check on this, DOC. Stay tuned. 

Thank you Chris.

I was auto-converted to "Starter." I still have not received the email that we're supposed to get.

I've disabled auto-renew on Starter.

Same here until I understand a compelling value for Connect. I don't use the on-line app, TV, or Mobile Ed. Nor do I envision doing so in the future. So like many users, those have no value for me.

Questions I don't understand to have been answered after looking at 8 pages of comments so far (I'll keep looking, but...)

1) At the start level I'm being auto-converted to, do we keep getting new Logos s/w earlier + access to the full feature set as in LN Now? Or would that access go away? 

2) At the starter level, do we keep getting permanent licenses to monthly free books of any kind? 

Thanks for clarifying.

Please reconsider offering LN separately from Faithlife Connect. We really don't care to pay extra to rent books, courses, and TV. Thanks!

exactly my thoughts. 

That was before Chris filled us in that it included any individual Mobile Ed course.

Access to two $750 courses a year? I took advantage of that benefit, and chose my first course yesterday. [ip]

Didn't they recently announce that the online app is part of the base packages?

If they take that away from us unless we keep Connect I will be extremely disappointed and likely will be then end of my patronage because I've been not so patiently longing for the web app to become as good as they promised.

Didn't they recently announce that the online app is part of the base packages?

It was originally a part of LN, but now is part of base packages, including the "free" one. That is not changing. 

Yep. Here's confirmation that it's free if you own 7.

https://blog.logos.com/2017/07/logos-7-now-can-use-web-app-free/

I have no use for Faithlife TV and I generally buy the Mobile Ed Courses I want because I can't necessarily fit them into my schedule in a short period.  I generally already own resources that are given free, and I also already own all of the feature sets to Logos 7.  The ONLY reason I use Logos Now is for the early release Logos 8 features.  What does Faithlife Connect get me that I will actually want?

Please reconsider offering LN separately from Faithlife Connect. We really don't care to pay extra to rent books, courses, and TV. Thanks!

exactly my thoughts. 

+1

[Y] [Y] [Y] [Y] [Y] 

I generally buy the Mobile Ed Courses I want because I can't necessarily fit them into my schedule in a short period.

It's a six month access period. If you don't complete the course, Chris said that we can choose the same course again.

Considering that it's any individual course (including the 20-hour ones that go for $750), it's not a bad benefit to get access to two courses a year.

I generally already own resources that are given free

Faithlife Connect (Essentials) also gives us one free Lexham Press or Kirkdale title a month. Might be a good opportunity to get a modern commentary such as EEC or Osborne Verse by Verse. Estimated benefit $350/yr.

What does Faithlife Connect get me that I will actually want?

Possibly nothing, if the above doesn't appeal to you. Verbum Now is currently not going away. Assuming that doesn't change by the time your LN subscription ends, you could sign up for Verbum Now to get early access to L9 features (since L8 will likely be available by then).

Didn't they recently announce that the online app is part of the base packages?

The web app is available for anyone with a Basic account and will continue with Connect. 

When will someone from the higher echelon of Logos address this to the masses here on FB?

Didn't they recently announce that the online app is part of the base packages?

The web app is available for anyone with a Basic account and will continue with Connect. 

I really did not understand this response.  Does this mean that anyone who has a base package will continue to have access to the web app regardless of whether they have connect or not? 

I really did not understand this response.  Does this mean that anyone who has a base package will continue to have access to the web app regardless of whether they have connect or not?

Correct. 

Chris, No e mail for me either if you could check.

Thanks

Chris, No e mail for me either if you could check.

Thanks

Thanks John, I'll look into it. 

Here's a challenge to all of those who are so terribly upset with Faithlife and their pricing scheme:  Go and assemble, say, a single Passage Guide of comparable Logos-quality using only the tools and means of a mere thirty years ago (I realize that many are too young to relate to this but the challenge is still applicable to you).  In other words, take pencil, paper, index cards, and typewriter to a theological library and manually research, document, and then organize into a professional-looking presentation all of the information that Logos would assemble for you.  And don't forget the time required for those interlibrary loans.   Any idea as to how long this chore would take you (assuming you don't get discouraged and quit)? Weeks, perhaps months.  And yet, with a few simple keystrokes and a couple of seconds of computer cycles, you have biblical research of a quality and quantity such as the world has never seen before.  Incredible, simply incredible.  But don't stop there ... consider also the datasets, the ability to search an entire library with a simple push of a button, the hyperlinking of every book in the library to every other book, the tools, etc. that you have in even the most basic Logos configuration.

Don't you recognize the enormous explosion in biblical studies that is happening right before your very eyes and that we are blessed to be a part of?  History rightly judges Gutenberg and his moveable type to have been a giant in his day and a necessary cog for the Reformation which changed the world ... imagine how it will judge the advent of the computer and Logos!

And yet, we whine about a few extra dollars to make it all happen.  We even impugn the motives of the Christian brothers and sisters at FaithLife.  Many seem to think that unless they have taken a monkish vow of poverty and work long hours for a crust of bread and a sip of water, they are somehow under the power of avarice.

But I say, Bring it on!  I am happy to invest in this amazing gift to the Church.  Even if I don't use all of the bells and whistles, I am pleased to know that I can help the development of these tools for others - not only for today but into the future as well.

You missed the point. The real issue is that we all bought into the Now concept based on a set of features and price that we all agreed to. Now FaithLife has renigged on their end of the bargain.

Chris,

Have not received a email yet.

Eric

Chris, No e mail for me either if you could check.

Thanks

Thanks John, I'll look into it. 

Your email came back as "undeliverable" in our email system and Customer Service will be reaching out to you manually. Please be patient as we're working through all the "undeliverable" emails. Thanks. 

Can you also assist me in resending my email? I seemed to have lost or not gotten one. Thanks!

I'll check on this for you. 

Your email came back as "undeliverable" in our email system and Customer Service will be reaching out to you manually. Please be patient as we're working through all the "undeliverable" emails. Thanks. 

Matthew, I have an ask to check on this. I'm sorry you haven't received any communication yet. I'll make sure to circle back on this when I find out something. You may be on a special email list that's coming directly from Customer Service as we had some customers with unique situations that we had to manually migrate and do special things for. You may be on that list. Thanks for your patience, my hope is you'll have closure sometime today. 

Your email came back as "undeliverable" in our email system and Customer Service will be reaching out to you manually. Please be patient as we're working through all the "undeliverable" emails. Thanks. 

I'll check on this, DOC. Stay tuned. 

Thank you Chris.

Your email came back as "undeliverable" in our email system and Customer Service will be reaching out to you manually. Please be patient as we're working through all the "undeliverable" emails. Thanks.