Personnel changes at Faithlife
Comments
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I am somewhat curious as to why this particular thread has such staying power.
The magnitude (15% of employees) is quite jarring, particularly for those of us who have invested a significant sum of money in Faithlife's products. In addition to the layoff of customer-facing sales representatives, Faithlife also significantly reduced the Verbum division before Christmas.
It is not surprising that there would be a lot of concern among its most loyal and engaged customers.
Agape,
Steve
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And companies don't typically lay off 15% of its staff unless there's some kind of trouble or concern, especially for a small, tight-knit company like FL.
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It was good of Bob to give this release but despite his assurances the changes in payment plans and multiply lay offs was bound to get people wondering about Faithlifes health and long term viability. The loss of long term contacts to company via sales staff going means these lay off broke connections people have long valued. I know I was curious if the salesperson who helped me was still around I emailed his Faithlife email expecting to hear back one way or another and never did, so even though I now know he is gone, the assurance that all emails were being checked on leads one to wonder why I never got a simple reply : "He is no longer here but I would be happy to help you when you need." As one person said if it looks like a duck walks like a duck and quacks like a duck.... It is easier to jump to what seems to be a logical conclusion but Bob has repeated told us Faithlife is in good financial condition. We have to trust in that or believe him to be a liar. I do not think with out hard evidence anyone wants to call him one.
Dan
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It is easier to jump to what seems to be a logical conclusion but Bob has repeated told us Faithlife is in good financial condition. We have to trust in that or believe him to be a liar. I do not think with out hard evidence anyone wants to call him one.
TIME IS A REVEALER OF ALL TRUTH! [;)]
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I am somewhat curious as to why this particular thread has such staying power. People get laid off all the time in businesses across America. People face tragedy and difficulties because of such layoffs. FL is just another business that has laid people off due to whatever circumstances being put out by the management team on these forums.
Short answer: Relationship and compassion.
People get laid off all the time in businesses across America.
Wow! A sad reality! Regardless, do you have to know people or enact a law to care and be concern?
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I am somewhat curious as to why this particular thread has such staying power. People get laid off all the time in businesses across America. People face tragedy and difficulties because of such layoffs. FL is just another business that has laid people off due to whatever circumstances being put out by the management team on these forums.
Nominations are now open ...
Instead of Artificial Intelligence, I prefer to continue to rely on Divine Intelligence instructing my Natural Dullness (Ps 32:8, John 16:13a)
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Nominations are now open ...
This thread has taken a lot of side routes.
Those who check the thread for any additional news concerning the original post (like me) have to wade through tons of posts they don't care about.
Could we please let these side issues die out here? Please start new threads to discuss them further if needed. Leave this thread for anyone who hasn't seen Bob's original post (is there anyone?) or any additional news about the original post.
Please? It's just respectful. No one is telling you to stop talking. Let's just make it a bit easier for many of us.
Thanks.
Pastor, North Park Baptist Church
Bridgeport, CT USA
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This thread has taken a lot of side routes.
Those who check the thread for any additional news concerning the original post (like me) have to wade through tons of posts they don't care about.
Could we please let these side issues die out here? Please start new threads to discuss them further if needed. Leave this thread for anyone who hasn't seen Bob's original post (is there anyone?) or any additional news about the original post.
Please? It's just respectful. No one is telling you to stop talking. Let's just make it a bit easier for many of us.
Thanks.
[Y] Thanks Mark, well said!!!
Dell, studio XPS 7100, Ram 8GB, 64 - bit Operating System, AMD Phenom(mt) IIX6 1055T Processor 2.80 GHZ
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Back on track...
It is disturbing that some of the "front line" people were affected by the layoff. They are the face and voice of the company and people are very loyal to them. Perhaps they did not fit the "used car salesperson" mode that we have all become used to of late. Still, a company like FL should nurture those who build strong customer relationships rather than show them the door.
Director of Zoeproject
www.zoeproject.com
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I appreciate the concern as well for the people who were laid off. Rest assured that those of us still at Faithlife share your concern, and more: these people are our friends, our neighbors in a small town, and people we go to church with.
Information about the condition of household economies in and around Bellingham can be found in the article linked to in this tweet https://twitter.com/seanboisen/status/689946763004895234
The good news is, they're great people who once made it through our hiring and screening process, and they shouldn't have much difficulty finding new situations. Other local employers have already reached out to me to get connected to these people, and our team is offering what support we can in recommendations, introductions, etc.
At least one Former employee has found new employment - Job Update | Hippie Heretic.
"The Christian mind is the prerequisite of Christian thinking. And Christian thinking is the prerequisite of Christian action." - Harry Blamires, 1963
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Back on track...
It is disturbing that some of the "front line" people were affected by the layoff. They are the face and voice of the company and people are very loyal to them. Perhaps they did not fit the "used car salesperson" mode that we have all become used to of late. Still, a company like FL should nurture those who build strong customer relationships rather than show them the door.
This is exactly the problem. Some on the board think they know how to run a company better than Bob. Have any of you ever started a successful company? Do you even have the faintest hint as to what all it actually takes to run a mid-sized successful company in today's market? What makes you think you know better than someone who has all the actual information? Obviously this is not the case when people suggest Faithlife should just toss some money at the folks so they can start their own company. Capital is a small part of starting a business. Drive, desire, ability, focus, and a willingness to put in a ton of time and work what gets it done. This is not something everyone has.
Many on this thread have said their messages come out of genuine concern and compassion, but if they really examine what they are writing and why, they would see that this is not really the case. We see lots of fear, worry, conjecture, questioning of Bob (directly on indirectly), over-spiritualization of every business decision, and statements about what Faithlife should do or should have done. How is any of this showing compassion to someone who got laid off?
Bob has stated that the company is fine. You can either accept this or call him a liar. Plenty on here seem to want to do the latter, just don't do it under a false guise of compassion. The Bible says don't be anxious about anything. So why are the ones who feel the need to give Faithlife so much Christian ethics advice the same ones who seem perfectly content to ignore this verse? The initial questions posted in this thread were fine and understandable. Since Bob has now spoken in very clear terms on this issue, anything beyond this is simple fearmongering by those who do not have all the facts.
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Danwdoo,
“Capital is a small part of starting a business”.
You have a point.
“Drive, desire, ability, focus, and a willingness to put in a ton of time and work what gets it done”.
Why do you think those laid-off workers don’t have the above traits? Do you know them personally, all 60+?
“This is not something everyone has”.
This is true. Does this invalidate the idea of starting a company from the pool of laid-off workers?
“We see lots of fear, worry, conjecture, questioning of Bob (directly on indirectly), over-spiritualization of every business decision, and statements about what Faithlife should do or should have done”.
I support Bob as a businessman to make decisions for the survivability of the company. Let the truth be told, there will be other changes down the road. Is there something inherently wrong with expressing concern for those who loss employment after many years of service to a company?
Bob is a big man. He doesn’t need defending.
“You can either accept this or call him a liar…just don't do it under a false guise of compassion”. Do I take this to believe that you have independent proof of this? Is this a fact or fear?
“The Bible says don't be anxious about anything. So why are the ones who feel the need to give Faithlife so much Christian ethics advice the same ones who seem perfectly content to ignore this verse?”
You seem to be doing the very thing (being “anxious”)-- projecting on others. Bob will be fine. His works will speak for him. Is it not still lawful for Americans to express opinions or make non-binding suggestions?
“The initial questions posted in this thread were fine and understandable. Since Bob has now spoken in very clear terms on this issue, anything beyond this is simple fearmongering by those who do not have all the facts”.
Are you trying to say you have “all the facts”? If you think you do, be at peace and allow others to express concern for the laid-off workers. It’s not “fearmongering”, my friend. Could it be that some people are speaking from past experiences where they were the best intentions, and “stuff” still happened? Also, could it be that some are speaking for those that feels, but can’t speak on this forum? I believe what Bob said about the company. The Question is, do you, really, believe him?
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Some on the board think they know how to run a company better than Bob. Have any of you ever started a successful company? Do you even have the faintest hint as to what all it actually takes to run a mid-sized successful company in today's market?
I only quoted two sentences, but the is by far the very best post in this entire thread. Thank you.
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Some on the board think they know how to run a company better than Bob. Have any of you ever started a successful company? Do you even have the faintest hint as to what all it actually takes to run a mid-sized successful company in today's market?
I only quoted two sentences, but the is by far the very best post in this entire thread. Thank you.
👌
Very to the point here.
Many posts in this thread are based on misinformation, gossip. Not very Christian imho.
MacOS Sierra / Logos 7 Collector's Edition & All Base Packages / Logos Now
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“Drive, desire, ability, focus, and a willingness to put in a ton of time and work what gets it done”.
Why do you think those laid-off workers don’t have the above traits? Do you know them personally, all 60+?
There is nothing in my post to suggest this. The point is, if these people have the desire and ability to start and run a successful company They will be the ones to drive any such effort, including the all important step of taking the initiative to organize and seek out capital. This isn't something Faithlife nor the members of this forum should drive..
“This is not something everyone has”.
This is true. Does this invalidate the idea of starting a company from the pool of laid-off workers?
See comment above
“We see lots of fear, worry, conjecture, questioning of Bob (directly on indirectly), over-spiritualization of every business decision, and statements about what Faithlife should do or should have done”.
I support Bob as a businessman to make decisions for the survivability of the company. Let the truth be told, there will be other changes down the road. Is there something inherently wrong with expressing concern for those who loss employment after many years of service to a company?
Bob is a big man. He doesn’t need defending.
You keep making innuendoes about the truth being told, truth will come out as if to suggest there are lies that will come to light. Until you have some direct evidence of something, the wise course of action is to say nothing at all.
“You can either accept this or call him a liar…just don't do it under a false guise of compassion”. Do I take this to believe that you have independent proof of this? Is this a fact or fear?
Isn't there a Biblical principle about not listening to accusations without multiple solid witnesses? I don't need proof that Bob isn't lying. His word is good until proven otherwise. So unless you have real evidence to the contrary, you are simply slinging mud.
“The Bible says don't be anxious about anything. So why are the ones who feel the need to give Faithlife so much Christian ethics advice the same ones who seem perfectly content to ignore this verse?”
You seem to be doing the very thing (being “anxious”)-- projecting on others. Bob will be fine. His works will speak for him. Is it not still lawful for Americans to express opinions or make non-binding suggestions?
Confronting what is borderline slander is not anxiety. Not all that is permissible is wise or right.
“The initial questions posted in this thread were fine and understandable. Since Bob has now spoken in very clear terms on this issue, anything beyond this is simple fearmongering by those who do not have all the facts”.
Are you trying to say you have “all the facts”? If you think you do, be at peace and allow others to express concern for the laid-off workers. It’s not “fearmongering”, my friend. Could it be that some people are speaking from past experiences where they were the best intentions, and “stuff” still happened? Also, could it be that some are speaking for those that feels, but can’t speak on this forum? I believe what Bob said about the company. The Question is, do you, really, believe him?
What part of your post has anything to do with concern for the wellbeing of laid off employees? Calling Bob's word into question has nothing to do with being compassionate. I don't claim to have any facts other than the fact that Bob said everything is fine and so he should be believed until there is true, verifiable cause to think otherwise. I am a former Biblesoft customer, so I am well familiar with the mess that a company like this collapsing leaves behind. That in no way, however, would justify spreading rumors and veiled accusations at anyone.
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People keep referring to Biblesoft because a number of us were customers. You might like to know that Biblesoft is alive and well and has just released a new version. While I did not bother to read the blurb carefully, I think I would have to pay quite a bit to be able to use it with my existing data.
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And companies don't typically lay off 15% of its staff unless there's some kind of trouble or concern, especially for a small, tight-knit company like FL.
I certainly can appreciate the concern of spending thousands of dollars on a product while watching large chunks of its staff released from employment. Yet I recall what has been handed down to me (in some past threads) is that FL is primarily a business for profit that just happens to focus on Christian products...at this time. In light of such knowledge it should be expected, like every other business, that it will go through regular changes in the attempt to produce more profit and opportunities. Nothing wrong with the process of growth with diversification. In the back of my mind however is that the buyer needs to beware of investing too much money, emotions, and time into a market driven business. Change should be expected. Even the possibility of going out of business or being sold to someone else.
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Some on the board think they know how to run a company better than Bob. Have any of you ever started a successful company? Do you even have the faintest hint as to what all it actually takes to run a mid-sized successful company in today's market?
I only quoted two sentences, but the is by far the very best post in this entire thread. Thank you.
Since everyone else has contributed, I might as well ....
You would have to think that the FaithLife business is a difficult one. They are packaging traditional products, ie books, which have always been low margin products, in a cutting edge tech product, which is morphing before their eyes. I work in a company that went web based over the past decade and it requires great focus, direction and responsiveness to resource allocation. Unfortunately, people are also counted as resources.
It's good to see that FaithLife is working to leverage what ever it has to in order to keep going. We have to accept it. It's the world we live in. Otherwise, Logos will certainly end up in the same bin as one of my other favourite tools. Ever heard of a company named Aristo? They also produced a state of the art tool but couldn't react to technological change. In 1975 they shut down.
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[Y]
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Danwdoo,
What I have written, I have written. I will pray for you, the layoff workers, Bob and for the profitability and survivability of the Faithlife Corp, that we may continue to enjoy the Logos Bible Software. Bob is at peace with himself and his company. May I suggest, you go do likewise. Until next time.
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I worked in the Tempe office. I've not heard anything to lead me to believe that Bob didn't do everything he could do to avoid this. I've seen him act with honesty and compassion too many times to believe otherwise.
Your prayers are much appreciated. Also if you have any software development leads in the Phoenix area, that also would be much appreciated.
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This is exactly the problem...
Well done on this post. Couldn't agree more.
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I worked in the Tempe office. I've not heard anything to lead me to believe that Bob didn't do everything he could do to avoid this. I've seen him act with honesty and compassion too many times to believe otherwise.
Thank you for sharing, I have tried to be neutral listening to both sides (I have also tried not to share gossip, but only state facts we have been given). The last thing most anyone wants is to down size. I feel for you and everyone who has been let go from FL. I realize that everything shared on the internet is not to be taken at face value but those who have shared at Glass Door have their experience and I do not think it should all be seen as sour grapes. As a user who has invested a significant amount of money I hope one way or another FL is around for many years. Have recent actions made this possible, I hope so. May God bless each one who has found themselves unemployed, I pray that all of you find fulfilling jobs soon.
-Dan
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To All Logos Users,
Logos Bible Software will be around for many years to come. Regardless of any future layoffs or changes, you will be able to enjoy all the fine features of this product. You have my word, Bob's word and the nature of the product.
We will not forget about those who were laid off and we will continue to pray for the families. Any laid off worker needs a listening ear or fresh hope may contact me directly. McNeil
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Logos Bible Software will be around for many years to come. Regardless of any future layoffs or changes, you will be able to enjoy all the fine features of this product. You have my word, Bob's word and the nature of the product.
I will sleep better tonight.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Logos Bible Software will be around for many years to come. Regardless of any future layoffs or changes, you will be able to enjoy all the fine features of this product. You have my word, Bob's word and the nature of the product.
I will sleep better tonight.
Me too. Maybe now someone from Logos could lock this thread..................
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"James Taylor" I was treated as if I'd made a pact with him to never purchase any other way. It was very strange.
James,
I had the identical thing happen to me about a eighteen months ago. And I had even previously referred a friend (to that salesperson) who purchased Logos 6 Silver. I have been a Logos user for ~16 years and have purchased through the Website as well as from many sales people -- that particular one, perhaps three times.
I called him for a price on a particular volume in a set of commentaries to which I was adding. Later that day he emailed me the price and I emailed him back to enter the order. Two days later, the resource still had not downloaded so I called him again. I got a message saying he was currently not in. I called back the next day and got the same message. So I finally placed the order with another salesman. About a week later I receive a phone call from the original salesperson in which he chewed me out royally for wasting his time. I was astonished by his attitude; he acted as if he owned exclusive rights to me as a Logos customer. From your depiction of the event, I think it was probably the same salesperson to whom you referred.
On the other hand, every other Logos salesperson with whom I have dealt has been extremely pleasant and helpful. I am happy to report that my unpleasant experience with this salesperson was a one-off.
_______________
On another matter, I have great sympathy for Bob (as well as those affected) over the recent layoffs. Before I retired I was the president of a retail corporation for 37 years. During my tenure the company went through several recessions in which some people had to be laid off because of the slow down in sales. One of my more difficult responsibilities as president was having to lay off a less efficient long-time employee because a newer employee was better motivated and was doing a far better job. I didn't take these decisions lightly, but if the company didn't survive then every employee would have lost his or her's job. Being the head of a company is not easy.
I was always generous with severance pay and tried to help the affected people find other jobs. Sometimes difficult decisions have to be made and it cannot be helped.
Bob is a really decent person.
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Just curious, no plans to SELL the company or be "acquired" right? ...asking for a friend [:D]
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Eight years after the penultimate post the friend seems to have missed the boat.
tootle pip
Mike
How to get logs and post them. (now tagging post-apocalyptic fiction as current affairs) Latest Logos, MacOS, iOS and iPadOS
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Hopefully in the new version of the forums, the dates of posts will be more prominently displayed... this happens all too often...
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