Announcing Logos Mobile Education
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Good stuff Dale, I like what I am hearing. If you have not done so, I may have missed it, partner with schools, to offer accredited courses. Say six hours towards a MA in Theology, or OT, etc..
The next step is to work with publishers so that if a text is required reading or a must when researching a topic (think ICC) the user can rent it for X time. That way everyone will have access to a professional library. After X time, the resource automatically locks in their library, unless they take it out again, up to Y times.
Mission: To serve God as He desires.
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Lynden Williams said:
Good stuff Dale, I like what I am hearing. If you have not done so, I may have missed it, partner with schools, to offer accredited courses. Say six hours towards a MA in Theology, or OT, etc..
The next step is to work with publishers so that if a text is required reading or a must when researching a topic (think ICC) the user can rent it for X time. That way everyone will have access to a professional library. After X time, the resource automatically locks in their library, unless they take it out again, up to Y times.
I agree on the part about accredited courses. Being able to complete some of my seminary training through Logos would be excellent. Logos itself doesn't need to be the "online institute", but if it can partner with a wide range of its institutes to allow some of the courses to go toward college credit, that'd be great.
I like the idea about "rentable" textbooks as well. Have them available for rent during the course, then have them disappear from the library when the course is complete. Then if we want permanent access to the book later on, purchase it.
Nathan Parker
Visit my blog at http://focusingonthemarkministries.com
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I wonder about the...well...the OBVIOUS. The fact that Logos isn't just going to be "tagging" and indexing current resources, but (at least from the sound of it) creating content. I realize that on some level they have done this in some ways already, but this could get to be a mine field of theological disputation. Now, I don't have a problem with that, but I sorta thought Logos did. [;)]
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Just what are we tagging and linking to? This raises several issues.
Does the student have sufficient resources to accommodate the tags and links? When we release the official pre-pub we will outline the basic assumptions that underlie the whole effort. One of objectives is to "not color outside the lines" as my mother used to say. On the one hand we want to create an education environment sufficient to the task of education on the subject under study. This means that the user must have a sufficiently large Logos library to accommodate all the links related to the course material since in our system there are no text books, but rather an entire library. Once we define the "lines" or boundaries our instructional designers are not allowed to link outside a designated standard book collection for primary links and not outside our available Logos resources for advanced and supplemental links. This means you do not have to get in your car and go to a theological library to complete any assignment. You may want to order additional resources for subject that are of great interest to you. In some specialty areas for example counseling the course designer may require additional titles as course requirements, much as any professor would do in a campus environment. In any case all this is known before you decide to invest in a particular course of study.
Now as to the mine field of theological disputation. Our course designers create all the links based on course perspective and the actual word by word text of the lecturers. They are naturally going to link to compatible resources to the points of the lecture. Choose a course with professors with whom you agree and there will be very little to dispute with the attendant links.
Our goal is to offer multiple courses from various theological perspectives. For those who desire it, there will also be courses offered that highlight multiple perspectives from adherents to those respective positions. We are facilitating the learning process, not embracing a single viewpoint.The links always go to background and support material for the current course perspective.
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Dale Pritchett said:
Just what are we tagging and linking to? This raises several issues.
A good start on tagging/linking would be what constitutes the Scholar's Library in L5 (Bronze?). Many seminaries require at least Scholar's/Bronze as the base Logos package for seminary-level courses (if they purchase higher, then great).
That would be the ideal starting point on tagging/linking resources. Most participants "should" have at least all the books in that collection if they're wanting to go full-fledged into seminary-level material.
Nathan Parker
Visit my blog at http://focusingonthemarkministries.com
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Ah, gee ! The courses I teach are quiet for the summer, I saw this potentially meaty learning opportunity pushed on the Logos software home page, and I got excited about some deeper learning now that the summer is relatively free. Then, what ....? I have the same questions as Erwin Stull plus is there a timeline when this becomes available ?
Bob Kostrubanic
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[Y]Dale Pritchett said:Our goal is to offer multiple courses from various theological perspectives.
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Dale Pritchett said:
Erwin, Thanks for your questions. I will give you some answers.
- Logos Mobile Ed is not an online course but rather a downloadable "curriculum resource," like a book. The difference is that this particular kind of "book" has the ability to initiate a video stream and also features on screen testing that accepts reader input. This new type of curriculum resource has attached, a Faithlife community note shared with everybody else who acquires the resource. The course becomes a permanent addition to your library. There is no need to ever forget this course content. It never goes away. It is searchable and links to the rest of your library.
- Initially courses will be seminary level courses targeted at people who's circumstances make it impractical or impossible to obtain a traditional seminary education. Could the courses be used for small groups or church institutes? Sure, why not?
- The courses will sell like Logos books as singles or bundles. There are about 100 courses in design and production. The prices are based on our cost to produce the product, but like all Logos products they represent a major savings over their traditional product format and they represent a new level of convenience and interactivity within the Logos ecosystem.
- When we make make the pre-publication offer there will be a web page with sample videos that illustrate the product.
- While we have accepted the role of curriculum designers, we have not become a degree granting institution. During the the past year of production word of our project has drifted into academic arena to the extent that several schools have asked us about incorporating these courses into their own distance ed programs. This will probably happen, offering people a path toward degree programs. Each school could add their own additional requirements and assignments. Our own focus is on education for people who just want or need to learn more. While our suggested course plans might look like an M. Div.program, they are not degree programs but rather opportunities to learn seminary/Bible college level materials in the Logos environment.
Thanks Dale; This is what I was looking for, and your answers have wet my appetite. I am looking forward to investigating the courses further once the project progresses.
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Ah, the timeline. Well I don't want to avoid the question but I must be somewhat vague. There are some final details in the interface programming to make sure you can easily find the course ware without having to search for it among hundreds or in come cases thousands of books in your library. This means we can't deliver it before it interface features are ready for inclusion in a scheduled software update, which means sometime this summer. The courses themselves are all different states of completion as will be the case for the next year or two as we expand our list. I am very excited. I have just been watching an OT lecture by Dr. Mark Futato of Reformed Theological Seminary. It is great. In a best case scenario I think we could be delivering courses at the end of July. After that we can add courses every month just like books. We have been recording professors and designing courses for nearly a year already. We are also doing a new Morris Proctor academic course in the Mobile Ed format and we are coming out with a totally new Learn to Use Greek and Hebrew set with many new features. There is a lot going on around here.
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Glad to know that I am not that far behind the curve on this new venture?
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Cost will be an issue. I am just about maxed out. I truly appreciate Logos, the program and the company, but about all I can afford now from time to time is a community pricing offer that I am interested in. Many of us do not get paid like a TV evangelist.
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Sounds like my situation. I could not pastor this church if I were not retired military as well as drawing Social Security; the funds I get from the church hardly cover my gas expense. I purchase and purchase the things I use and use, but eventually must just use what I have already purchased. Hopefully at some point we will be able to move into more of these materials; the need for them is absolutely massive.
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Cost: As I stated in an earlier response, we base our prices on our cost to produce the product. We are not focused on making the most affordable product but rather the best solution. That being said we know that the cost of education has risen in the past few years to the point at which people are searching for alternatives. There are a lot of free education opportunities on the internet but it is hard to distinguish between good and bad programs and none of them are connected to essential library resources. That’s where Logos Mobile Education comes in.
Here is our formula for maximum reduction in the cost of a first class education in Biblical studies.
- Don’t give up your job
- Don’t relocate you family
- Stay home. Save travel expense by not commuting to schools and libraries
- Master your Logos software. Proficiency will buy you more time in your day.
- Build up your digital library for ministry.
- Take the best mobile education courses you can afford.
- Learn in the very same environment in which you study and prepare your lessons and sermons.
- Become an active participant in an online community with other students
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Will you offer payment plans as well? It might be a good option for those wishing to take some solid classes but need a more flexible way to pay for them.
This is basically what I do for college now. I charge each semester on a CC and pay it off using my WeatherBug paychecks. I haven't received any scholarships, so I'm just handling it this way. God is providing and giving me a solid education and a job to help pay for it, so I'm happy.
Nathan Parker
Visit my blog at http://focusingonthemarkministries.com
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Payment Plans -- We have not given that any discussion at all. I will look into that. Thanks.
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Dale Pritchett said:
There are a lot of free education opportunities on the internet but it is hard to distinguish between good and bad programs
This is why we have accreditation agencies. I am really excited about Logos Mobile Education from what I have heard so far. However, if anyone is looking to be employed in any type of ministry from teaching to pastoring, most opportunities are going to require an accredited degree. I totally understand the concept of learning for the sake or learning, or learning for the sake of better ministry. However, when I was considering options for doctoral work years ago, I considered a distance school because it was cheap and I could stay in my place of ministry. It was also very credible, but not accredited by ATS or SACS. One of my M.Div. professors gave me great advice: "If you are going to do the work, you need to get credit for it."
I read Dale's earlier statement that schools were asking about partnering with Logos to offer credit for these courses. I really hope this happens and quickly. If these classes truly are Master's level courses, then people need to get Master's credit for them. Credit they can use toward degrees that will give them credentials to take advantage of ministry opportunities. For those individuals not seeking an type of vocational service this is not an issue, but for everyone else I would urge you to think about building up credentials that will be recognized by your future employers.
This is really exciting and I am looking forward to seeing it come to fruition!
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I am 100% for this type of partnership. However, I have never seen an accredited school grant credit for external programs without gouging the student with unearned fees. It seems common to charge $100 per credit hour entered on a transcript. The granting school is selling their name at a great profit. If you must deal with the profiteers in the temple courts I guess it has to be. But I just want the option to learn the material without the high fees. Many churches would rather have the education than the degree. "No credit" should be an option at a lower fee.Kevin Maples said:I read Dale's earlier statement that schools were asking about partnering with Logos to offer credit for these courses. I really hope this happens and quickly.
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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Super Tramp said:
"No credit" should be an option at a lower fee.
I agree. I would just like to see both options.
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May I recommend a foundational course (maybe two) on
What Does the Bible say about Heaven and Hell?
Or Perhaps something more selective
What did Jesus about Heaven?
What did Jesus about Hell?
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May I recommend a foundational course (maybe two) on
What Does the Bible say about Heaven and Hell?
Or Perhaps something more selective
What did Jesus Say about Heaven?
What did Jesus Say about Hell?
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Kevin Maples said:Dale Pritchett said:
There are a lot of free education opportunities on the internet but it is hard to distinguish between good and bad programs
This is why we have accreditation agencies. I am really excited about Logos Mobile Education from what I have heard so far. However, if anyone is looking to be employed in any type of ministry from teaching to pastoring, most opportunities are going to require an accredited degree. I totally understand the concept of learning for the sake or learning, or learning for the sake of better ministry. However, when I was considering options for doctoral work years ago, I considered a distance school because it was cheap and I could stay in my place of ministry. It was also very credible, but not accredited by ATS or SACS. One of my M.Div. professors gave me great advice: "If you are going to do the work, you need to get credit for it."
I read Dale's earlier statement that schools were asking about partnering with Logos to offer credit for these courses. I really hope this happens and quickly. If these classes truly are Master's level courses, then people need to get Master's credit for them. Credit they can use toward degrees that will give them credentials to take advantage of ministry opportunities. For those individuals not seeking an type of vocational service this is not an issue, but for everyone else I would urge you to think about building up credentials that will be recognized by your future employers.
This is really exciting and I am looking forward to seeing it come to fruition!
True. If there was an option where we could apply these courses to college credits, I'd be very interested. Being able to perform my coursework directly inside Logos and get credit for it in seminary would be excellent. I've dreamed of doing this for a very long time.
Nathan Parker
Visit my blog at http://focusingonthemarkministries.com
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Super Tramp said:
I am 100% for this type of partnership. However, I have never seen an accredited school grant credit for external programs without gouging the student with unearned fees. It seems common to charge $100 per credit hour entered on a transcript. The granting school is selling their name at a great profit. If you must deal with the profiteers in the temple courts I guess it has to be. But I just want the option to learn the material without the high fees. Many churches would rather have the education than the degree. "No credit" should be an option at a lower fee.Kevin Maples said:I read Dale's earlier statement that schools were asking about partnering with Logos to offer credit for these courses. I really hope this happens and quickly.
Another good option as well. For those that want the credits, pay extra for them, but for those that want an iTunes-U like audit approach, offer it for less. Good discussion so far on both sides.
Nathan Parker
Visit my blog at http://focusingonthemarkministries.com
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Joshua Lieder said:
May I recommend a foundational course (maybe two) on
What Does the Bible say about Heaven and Hell?
Or Perhaps something more selective
What did Jesus about Heaven?
What did Jesus about Hell?
Charles Stanley also still has a lot of his course material from the former Charles Stanley Institute for Christian Living. A lot of his videos and coursework is already in electronic format, so it wouldn't take much to convert it to Logos format. It'd be great to revive this into Logos format. I'd sure pay to have it!
Nathan Parker
Visit my blog at http://focusingonthemarkministries.com
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Kevin Maples said:Dale Pritchett said:
There are a lot of free education opportunities on the internet but it is hard to distinguish between good and bad programs
This is why we have accreditation agencies. I am really excited about Logos Mobile Education from what I have heard so far. However, if anyone is looking to be employed in any type of ministry from teaching to pastoring, most opportunities are going to require an accredited degree. I totally understand the concept of learning for the sake or learning, or learning for the sake of better ministry. However, when I was considering options for doctoral work years ago, I considered a distance school because it was cheap and I could stay in my place of ministry. It was also very credible, but not accredited by ATS or SACS. One of my M.Div. professors gave me great advice: "If you are going to do the work, you need to get credit for it."
I read Dale's earlier statement that schools were asking about partnering with Logos to offer credit for these courses. I really hope this happens and quickly. If these classes truly are Master's level courses, then people need to get Master's credit for them. Credit they can use toward degrees that will give them credentials to take advantage of ministry opportunities. For those individuals not seeking an type of vocational service this is not an issue, but for everyone else I would urge you to think about building up credentials that will be recognized by your future employers.
This is really exciting and I am looking forward to seeing it come to fruition!
I completely agree. This is a great idea for a resource, but it is not a substitute for a course for which one would receive credit; therefore, it should not be priced as such. If the price is right (I have no idea what the right price should be), then I will certainly take advantage of some of these unique resources!
Disclaimer: I hate using messaging, texting, and email for real communication. If anything that I type to you seems like anything other than humble and respectful, then I have not done a good job typing my thoughts.
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Hi Joshua,
This might be what you are looking for:
http://www.learnlogos.com/Heaven_What_the_Bible_Teaches_Series_p/heaven.htm
http://www.learnlogos.com/Hell_What_the_Bible_Teaches_Series_p/hell.htm
Enjoy!
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Nathan Parker said:
Charles Stanley also still has a lot of his course material from the former Charles Stanley Institute for Christian Living. A lot of his videos and coursework is already in electronic format, so it wouldn't take much to convert it to Logos format. It'd be great to revive this into Logos format. I'd sure pay to have it!
Me too. (boldface in quote mine)
Logos 7 Collectors Edition
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[Y]Kevin Maples said:This is why we have accreditation agencies. I am really excited about Logos Mobile Education from what I have heard so far. However, if anyone is looking to be employed in any type of ministry from teaching to pastoring, most opportunities are going to require an accredited degree. I totally understand the concept of learning for the sake or learning, or learning for the sake of better ministry. However, when I was considering options for doctoral work years ago, I considered a distance school because it was cheap and I could stay in my place of ministry. It was also very credible, but not accredited by ATS or SACS. One of my M.Div. professors gave me great advice: "If you are going to do the work, you need to get credit for it."
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I am excited to see what courses will be offered. I will complete my BS in Religion in April 2014 and would love to use the classes to supplement my current education. So will it be general courses, prescribe courses around a topic, or classes for credit? Many questions, will you provide more answers? Please!
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This is truly exciting news! How does this integrate with your Knox Theological Seminary (KTS) relationship? IS KTS the feeder group for instructors? What is the vetting process for your potential instructors?
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Very good poijt. Sort of a "cart before the horse" problem.
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