Official: You Can Now Get Early Access to the Next Version of Logos

Over about a decade, I've spent about $500 in Logos. However I live in Asia and the exchange rate is not favorable, plus my working at a charity is not lucrative (definitely below the local median income, not to mention the US). Though $500 might seem like peanuts to some, it's a not insignificant investment for me. I do want Logos to succeed, but I'm not able to justify a subscription, based on what I need to use Logos for. I do hope that small-time customers such as I will be able to purchase features and resources incrementally as our limited budget allows.

Through my subscription, I have “temporary access” to a lot of resources (290). I can see what those are through the Logos library,” but can’t do a simple search for those on the website store. To wit: I would like to see a list of what each of these “temporary” resources (or packages, as is more likely) would cost to “own” them, so I would still have access to what I’ve been using should I decide not to move to the “Logos Pro” subscription.

There is no simple way.

If you want to buy Connect resources make a list of those you consider essential and compare those with the list of books at https://www.logos.com/early-access. Buy only the books that are not on that list, as they will likely be "lost" when your Connect subscription is terminated. You can buy the others later on if you will not subscribe to Logos Pro.

My Logos Now subscription is up for renewal in May but it looks like the new subscription model will only be available later in the Fall. It is unclear to me what to do in May, if I should renew my Logos Now subscription or switch to Logos Pro.

Mark Barnes (Logos) has advised that you should stay with your present subscription so as not to miss out on your perks. The switch to LPro could be expensive if you do not have the L10 Full Feature set.

My Logos Now subscription renews in a weeks time. I guess I continue with it even though I have Full Feature set. Let's hope FL considers this when the new subscription models come out and there is an overlap of functionality.

No offense, but this is often the case with companies.  A new plan is floated (subscription based), the company says you will always have an option, but...slowly and eventually subscription becomes the norm.  I'm thinking a consistent revenue stream would be attractive to Logos, would it not? 

My Logos Now subscription renews in a weeks time. I guess I continue with it even though I have Full Feature set.

I would continue if it is a monthly subscription, else consider Early Access monthly.

The logos bronze 9 now have major discounts 

Will they still kbe available when this subscription service comes ?

The subscription service being talked about is mostly for features.

Legacy libraries (like you mentioned in your question) are for book type resources only, not for features. They contain only books, journals, etc.

Will they still be available? Only the folks at Logos know the answer to that one. My guess is yea, they will, but still at a sale price? Probably not.

I am eagerly looking forward to the addition of some AI functionality to Logos. 

I am apprehensively looking forward to the movement of Logos to a subscription model. 

I understand why subscription is appealing to the Logos financial folks, and some categories of users.  I would personally benefit from more frequent updates during the next 2-3 years as the AI features are developed and integrated.  But software by subscription for everyone, forever, is not in the long term interest of many, if not most, non-professional users.  A non-subscription option needs to remain available.

I'm not a big subscription fan, but I get the challenge of making AI available. I'm very grateful Logos is investing in this technology and might become a subscriber in the future!

That said, I detest subscription-only models for various reasons and am nervous that Logos would even consider it. I hope subscriptions remain complementary and only enhance the software (as with AI) instead of becoming the only way to access the power of Full Feature Sets. 

One more thing. Why is the following part placed behind a paywall and not simply a quality-of-life update? I did not expect something like this from Logos...

Instant Dark/Light Mode allows you to switch between light and dark mode on desktop without requiring you to restart Logos.

I think that's a puzzle to lots of us.

I'm not a big subscription fan, but I get the challenge of making AI available. I'm very grateful Logos is investing in this technology and might become a subscriber in the future!

That said, I detest subscription-only models for various reasons and am nervous that Logos would even consider it. I hope subscriptions remain complementary and only enhance the software (as with AI) instead of becoming the only way to access the power of Full Feature Sets. 

One more thing. Why is the following part placed behind a paywall and not simply a quality-of-life update? I did not expect something like this from Logos...

Instant Dark/Light Mode allows you to switch between light and dark mode on desktop without requiring you to restart Logos.

You would hope that something like that would be added to a regular update. There is some concern, which is why many of us are against the subscription only model- that these types of improvements will be used to bait people into subscriptions. It's clear the AI doesn't necessarily have a lot of desire for many users, so if that is what subscription is limited to and Logos is committed to subscription only, they need some sort of bait to string people into the subscription.

If Instant Dark/Light mode remains behind a paywall, that will be the writing on the wall for me.  Features like that cannot be behind a paywall.  I woudl expect if they are, FL will discover very quickly that they made a blunder worse than any other blunder.

If Instant Dark/Light mode remains behind a paywall, that will be the writing on the wall for me.  Features like that cannot be behind a paywall.  I would expect if they are, FL will discover very quickly that they made a blunder worse than any other blunder.

I believe Logos has previously stated that instant Dark/Light mode will be made available to non-subscribers in the fall.

If Instant Dark/Light mode remains behind a paywall, that will be the writing on the wall for me.  Features like that cannot be behind a paywall.  I woudl expect if they are, FL will discover very quickly that they made a blunder worse than any other blunder.

I’ve had instant dark/light mode forever with my Mac and iPhone 😂😂😂 You adjust the display/brightness and choose light or dark mode and every app that supports it becomes dark or light automatically without having to restart anything.  That’s why I never understood this being a subscription “feature” when I’ve had it for the longest.

DAL

Our main concern should be serving God. In my case, I am into Christian Education. Whether software expense is monthly or every two years is not the issue from a customer point of view.  Although the product needs to be maintained over operating system and software interface changes, it is not as important to me to be able to constantly add new functionality. I already have concerns about using a network host machine to do language translation. I need the product to work locally without network access. Periodic connection to the network is OK. 

Paying for software on a monthly basis has additional costs. I submit that constantly billing a customer each month and handling the additional book keeping costs is not less expensive in the long run than updating and paying periodically. Requiring different books (E.G 400 books) adds extra expense. We have already invested heavily in current functionality and the access to our current books. Ability to only read our old books is not enough. Current functionality should be maintained. I have nearly every book I might ever need. Improving current functionality is a good thing... but not at a huge extra expense amortized over many months. Although I have updated every two years since Logos 6, I do not want to be dependent for any kind of functionality based on a subscription expense model.

AI is new and needs time to adapt. The technology is in its infancy. We are here to serve God more than adopt a technology in its infancy. That feature could come in time.

I don't like the direction Logos is going with this. I have no interest in bringing AI into my Bible studies, or any part of my life. I have no interest in paying for an ongoing subscription to maintain access to books of their or my choosing. I don't want to rent the software. I don't like the way they're using Logos Pro as a carrot to try to lure folks into perpetual monthly payments. And I don't like that I've spent so much on Logos 10 Reformed Portfolio, plus additional resources, only to find this state of flux and uncertainty going forward. 

I was content using Olive Tree for Bible study and although I had already invested a fair amount in that software, I made the switch to Logos when I went back to college for theological studies. I saw a clear benefit to justify the substantial expense. I was very impressed and recommended Logos to anyone that was looking for Bible study software. I can no longer make that recommendation. I'm very disappointed. If they go subscription only, support for legacy editions will eventually go away. Without the option of purchasing an upgrade, the money to maintain legacy editions would have to come from their subscription income and that'll look less attractive as time goes on. 

I've only been using Logos for a year and a half now. If it had been subscription only, or they had said that was the way there were going when I was looking for something more robust than Olive Tree, I'd be invested in Accordance right now. 

I really hope the subscription model becomes an option, and not the only way to move forward with Logos. I'm sure a subscription plan will work for some people, but it's not for me. 

I am eagerly looking forward to the addition of some AI functionality to Logos. 

There is an article in The Conversation reporting that the Google browser feature "AI Overviews" -- which is supposed to summarize written content (like Logos says it will do in their software)  -- recently reported to one user that people should eat one rock per day as a source of minerals (according to a UC Berkeley study), and another that said you can add glue to pizza sauce to keep the cheese from sliding off. Another response reported that astronauts had encountered cats on the moon.

I am not looking forward to AI becoming part of Logos.

https://theconversation.com/eat-a-rock-a-day-put-glue-on-your-pizza-how-googles-ai-is-losing-touch-with-reality-230953

There is an article in The Conversation reporting that the Google browser feature "AI Overviews" -- which is supposed to summarize written content (like Logos says it will do in their software)  -- recently reported to one user that people should eat one rock per day as a source of minerals (according to a UC Berkeley study), and another that said you can add glue to pizza sauce to keep the cheese from sliding off. Another response reported that astronauts had encountered cats on the moon.

GIGO, I guess. The AI summarize feature in Logos is working on one book at a time, not pulling data from all over the internet and spitting out a Franken-thing. Now, if my Logos book has garbage mixed in, I won't be surprised if the generated summary is smelly as well.

GIGO, I guess. The AI summarize feature in Logos is working on one book at a time, not pulling data from all over the internet and spitting out a Franken-thing. Now, if my Logos book has garbage mixed in, I won't be surprised if the generated summary is smelly as well.

My understanding of gen AI is that even if the inputs are not garbage, you can get garbage out. The reason is the following: gen AI is simply cobbling together a collage of words instead of collage of pictures.

Let me illustrate...

Let Document A say: "I could run uphill at 5 miles per hour."

Let Document B say: "I run downhill at 10 miles per hour."

Both of the above are correct statements.

If I ask "What speed can I run uphill?" it might cobble together "I could run uphill" from document A and "at 10 miles per hour" from document B to give you an answer "I could run uphill at 10 miles per hour", which would be an incorrect statement.

You can see that garbage is spewed even when it is collecting information from correct sources.

Please, people who are techies, let me know if my understanding is correct.

You can see that garbage is spewed even when it is collecting information from correct sources.

The Logos summarization feature is giving you a summary for Document A, another summary for Document B, and so on. It isn't giving you a summary that is a combination of Documents A and B.

(As to whether it can take the info in Document A only and still cobble together nonsense, I don't know enough to say, but this uncertainty is not  enough for me stop using the feature. But I certainly wouldn't trust it if it was set up like Google's AI Overview.)

1Cor10 31">You can see that garbage is spewed even when it is collecting information from correct sources.

The Logos summarization feature is giving you a summary for Document A, another summary for Document B, and so on. It isn't giving you a summary that is a combination of Documents A and B.

(As to whether it can take the info in Document A only and still cobble together nonsense, I don't know enough to say, but this uncertainty is not  enough for me stop using the feature. But I certainly wouldn't trust it if it was set up like Google's AI Overview.)

I was using 2-document example to illustrate the collage metaphor.

Wouldn't we get the same garbage if both statements were there in the same document also (which is what AI summary does - summarize from a single document)?

Please, people who are techies, let me know if my understanding is correct.

I don't believe that is how AI works. Simply, it is a language-based program that uses algorithms based on linguistic rules that are backed up by datasets, not a program that collages information regardless of the source of origins and context. So in your hypothetical documents, the 5 miles per hour will be tied to running uphill due to the context and syntax of the sentence. So if you ask it a question, it is going to answer based on the documents provided. It should not, unless the wording in the documents is misleading, give an incorrect answer by changing the numbers around in your scenario because that would break the linguistic rules.

The reason why AI gives incorrect answers is based on the algorithms. It is sometimes difficult for it to determine what is true and false, such as fiction and non-fiction or satirical and non-satirical writings. Secondly, words and syntax have and create multiple meanings and thus can create misunderstandings. Thirdly, it has to account for cultural/regional terminologies too. I can say I want a coke in Texas, when I really want a Dr. Pepper. However, someone in South Dakota may say pop or soda. In essence, language is ambiguous and that is the main reason why it gets information wrong.

I am pretty sure this list of reasons why AI gives incorrect answers is longer than this, but the main point is that it should not collage information in a way that breaks linguistics rules as your scenario provided. 

Please, people who are techies, let me know if my understanding is correct.

No, assuming you are talking about AI in the sense of the popular large language models behind chatbots. They are working off knowledge they have gleaned from documents not the documents themselves unless you have fed a document into it as part of your query. Generative AI vs. LLMs: What's the Difference? (kovaion.com) provides a short overview

I finally had some time to give the free trial a little time (I will never subscribe, but wanted to see what was going on, so I have at least a little understanding)

A few resources that I didn't have that were nice, but not worth renting via subscription and losing when I cancel.

The AI features.... Fair Warning, so maybe a slight bias - but I am not a fan of using AI to write sermons/lectures/teaching lessons - these should come through study, prayer and commitment to the subject - not a microwaved, AI generated script! Also - does plagiarism not potentially get twisted into this weave of generated data?

The Insights bar.... Could be a decent addition, but not worth subscription

Summarization could be useful, especially for books a user is not familiar with - though I did test it on a PB that I added from my ebooks and it would not work there. Again not worth a subscription.

I don't use Dark Mode on my PC version, so the instant Dark/Light doesn't intrigue me - but I do agree with what many have stated about the feature. If it is behind the subscription paywall, that's just a sign of how bad the new Logos is getting.

So, overall I can see the benefit of this subscription for new users or users really interested in AI Features. Users with larger libraries and no interest in AI, well they'd basically be paying to be a Beta tester of old - getting early access to features not yet public.

Now the question is..... Are the new users and those interested in AI more valuable in the eyes of Mark Barnes and the PE firm than the long term customers that have no interest in subscription only and want to own their features.....  We have 4 days remaining for the next update some of us were told was a goal by the end of this month..... Hopefully our feedback is honored - anything that does not include the ability to outright purchase and not have to subscribe is a slap in the face to all of us who have given our feedback against Subscription Only (and yes that includes any "Rent to Own" scheme of the Subscription method.)

As a longtime user with a very large library, I agree with much of what you said, Frank. However, for myself the AI all search has been very useful whereas the previous version was of absolutely no use although the version before that (the multisectioned one) had specific uses.

As a longtime user with a very large library, I agree with much of what you said, Frank. However, for myself the AI all search has been very useful whereas the previous version was of absolutely no use although the version before that (the multisectioned one) had specific uses.

I think that's a fair observation as well, though it still wouldn't carry enough value for me to ever Subscribe - and then the current $9.99 if the vague info is understood correctly is a discount for L10 Full Feature owners, so the cost will likely be higher for everyone else - which carries even less value.

It would have been nice if Logos worked on improving the Search function(s) without the cost of AI - supposedly the AI path allows the easy search without knowing the search variables/strings/commands - would have been nice to leave AI out and just improve it overall.... Seems like that has been on the long time user wishlist for years....

Frank Sauer: "It would have been nice if Logos worked on improving the Search function(s) without the cost of AI..."

I would agree with that. Over the years I have used the KJV, NIV, ESV, and NASB95. So sometimes when I'm searching for a particular phrase I type in some of the words from each version giving me a "nothing found" from the Logos search engine. It's frustrating.

But, I can copy and paste the same words into Bible Hub (on line) and get the correct hit almost every time. This should not be the case.

That said, I am enjoying the AI feature, but I don't know that it's worth $10/month.

For me in my use case, the summarize feature alone is a huge time saver when I am shifting through journal articles or monographs.

If this is already this useful as an 'early access' product, the future is bright.

I also like the opportunity to see new features added more frequently than every two years. The new dynamic resource toolbar is going to be a nice value add when they roll it out. 

In general, I like the direction of travel that this is going. I know this does not solve the ownership questions raised by many, so if they can land that plane well, we might have the best of all worlds.

I would agree with that. Over the years I have used the KJV, NIV, ESV, and NASB95. So sometimes when I'm searching for a particular phrase I type in some of the words from each version giving me a "nothing found" from the Logos search engine. It's frustrating.

Does not the Fuzzy view in the Bible Search give you a match on those occasions?

I think the AI messaging is confusing the issue. From my understanding the subscription cost essentially replaces the bi-annual feature set. The argument is there is a need for steady revenue vs getting funds every 2 years focused on the software.

In exchange, we are supposed to receive incremental updates throughout the 2 years and ultimately feel as if it has similar value over that time period (factoring in inflation). The AI happens to be a cool, incremental change, but in no way should justify the subscription fee on its own.

Or stated in another way, if I am a M365 user, I don’t judge if the value is there by a single update. I judge the value on the benefit of the software to me and if I feel there are enough new features vs. buying a static legacy edition.

The other challenge with AI is the category is too broad, and really has nuances in its capabilities and how it is deployed. I’m not interested in generative AI, but might benefit from the substantially improved search!

For me in my use case, the summarize feature alone is a huge time saver when I am shifting through journal articles or monographs.

If this is already this useful as an 'early access' product, the future is bright.

I was hoping this would be the case, but it has not been usable for me so far.  Even trying summarize a 15 page chapter in a simple monograph has given me the dreaded “too many pages to summarize” message. Logos support replied to me, saying this is not a bug, but a natural limitation of their AI, meaning it’s not something that’s going to be “fixed.”  Not sure how people are using it on entire journal articles, which are typically 25+ pages, when it cant even do single chapters of popular level monographs?

I was hoping this would be the case, but it has not been usable for me so far.  Even trying summarize a 15 page chapter in a simple monograph has given me the dreaded “too many pages to summarize” message. Logos support replied to me, saying this is not a bug, but a natural limitation of their AI, meaning it’s not something that’s going to be “fixed.”

Have you tried it recently?

Mark posted on Friday - https://community.logos.com/forums/p/221871/1299058.aspx#1299058 - that they now support summarizing much longer articles.

I was hoping this would be the case, but it has not been usable for me so far.  Even trying summarize a 15 page chapter in a simple monograph has given me the dreaded “too many pages to summarize” message. Logos support replied to me, saying this is not a bug, but a natural limitation of their AI, meaning it’s not something that’s going to be “fixed.”

Have you tried it recently?

Mark posted on Friday - https://community.logos.com/forums/p/221871/1299058.aspx#1299058 - that they now support summarizing much longer articles.

Good to know.  I haven’t tried it since my free trial ran out last month, and I just didn’t find any useful features, given the limitations of AI summarize at the time.  If I ever receive another free trial offer I will give it another try to see if the way AI summarize now works changes my mind about subscribing.

it would still be helpful if they could come up with a page count or word count limitation that could be posted as a guideline.

I have tried out the new AI features.  Here's my opinion:

• Logos is making a mistake moving to a (primarily?) subscription model that's going to hurt them long term.  People today have subscription fatigue and are much less likely to sign up if it's a subscription rather than a purchase.  With a purchase, you feel you're making an investment with every purchase.  With a subscription, you feel much less commitment to a product.  Since Logos is also continuing to sell resources, this makes their marketing far more confusing.  I imagine trying to explain to someone what they should buy and attaching a subscription to a commentary purchase makes it far less compelling.
• I would rather have no AI features at all than have to pay a monthly subscription for the latest features.  The AI features were not very useful, especially if you have used Logos with a (free) ChatGPT window open next to it.  You can already copy, paste, and summarize.  I did not find the AI search very useful (maybe it will get better?), and the sermon assistant is easily accomplished in ChatGPT apart from Logos.  I can see how it would be helpful for people who have never actively used ChatGPT as a tool, but learning to use ChatGPT gives you 85% of the added benefit of Logos Pro, which decreases its value significantly.
• The fact that you're including instant light/dark mode in Pro doesn't make sense.  This is not an AI feature and is simply holding back a feature from users who don't subscribe.  If this is indicative of Logos' future direction, then this is very disappointing.  Logos has always promised that the engine is free to use for your purchased resources.  How is this not part of the engine?  
• I own the majority of commentaries and resources included in Pro, and yet I get no discount or dynamic pricing on a subscription.  How does this make sense for someone like me who has invested so much in Logos?  I think you're going to frustrate your primary user base by making this move.  

Personally, I will not be getting a subscription, and at this point, I will not be recommending Logos until we see how this pans out.  I'm hoping that the subscription model will fizzle, and we'll go back to purchasing feature updates as before.  If that happens, I'll continue to commend Logos as a good investment.  Until then, I'm not so sure.  That's my 2 cents. 

I have tried out the new AI features.  Here's my opinion:

• Logos is making a mistake moving to a (primarily?) subscription model that's going to hurt them long term.  People today have subscription fatigue and are much less likely to sign up if it's a subscription rather than a purchase.  With a purchase, you feel you're making an investment with every purchase.  With a subscription, you feel much less commitment to a product.  Since Logos is also continuing to sell resources, this makes their marketing far more confusing.  I imagine trying to explain to someone what they should buy and attaching a subscription to a commentary purchase makes it far less compelling.
• I would rather have no AI features at all than have to pay a monthly subscription for the latest features.  The AI features were not very useful, especially if you have used Logos with a (free) ChatGPT window open next to it.  You can already copy, paste, and summarize.  I did not find the AI search very useful (maybe it will get better?), and the sermon assistant is easily accomplished in ChatGPT apart from Logos.  I can see how it would be helpful for people who have never actively used ChatGPT as a tool, but learning to use ChatGPT gives you 85% of the added benefit of Logos Pro, which decreases its value significantly.
• The fact that you're including instant light/dark mode in Pro doesn't make sense.  This is not an AI feature and is simply holding back a feature from users who don't subscribe.  If this is indicative of Logos' future direction, then this is very disappointing.  Logos has always promised that the engine is free to use for your purchased resources.  How is this not part of the engine?  
• I own the majority of commentaries and resources included in Pro, and yet I get no discount or dynamic pricing on a subscription.  How does this make sense for someone like me who has invested so much in Logos?  I think you're going to frustrate your primary user base by making this move.  

Personally, I will not be getting a subscription, and at this point, I will not be recommending Logos until we see how this pans out.  I'm hoping that the subscription model will fizzle, and we'll go back to purchasing feature updates as before.  If that happens, I'll continue to commend Logos as a good investment.  Until then, I'm not so sure.  That's my 2 cents. 

Well said! 

I wish Logos would fix this. Or communicate.  Or something.  Maybe I am dreaming. The momentum of new users bypassing Logos is concerning when I think about my Logos investment and the future.

I agree,  AI integration in Logos seems little more than useless as it is. I find alternatives better in most cases.  The key features we want remain unfinished.  New Resources do not include what we do want and bucketloads of what we don't. It ain't looking good. I've seen this before and it never lasted long.

Seriously Faithlife, what is this: https://www.logos.com/early-access/faq?utm_campaign=promo-earlyaccess&utm_source=sfmc&utm_medium=email&utm_content=05282024_Logos_ENG_EN_Subscription-Comms-VIPs&utm_term=https%3a%2f%2flogos.com%2fearly-access%2ffaq&utm_id=211051&sfmc_id=38902612

These subscriptions will replace Preaching Suite, Faithlife Connect, and other Logos feature sets."

I understand we got an email saying: 

Perpetual access. We’ve received an overwhelming response that our customers want to buy forever-access to Logos features. Our team is taking all your feedback into account, and we are excited to announce perpetual feature licensing, in some form, will be a component of our new subscription model. However, the focus will be on the subscription product. We’re still working out the details, so stay tuned. As always, the content you’ve purchased is yours forever and accessible with or without a subscription."

As a person who loves to use Logos, do not do subscription-only model that replaces feature sets. You can do both, but don't limit it to just that!

Also, this:

The three subscription tiers are designed to fit the main ways people use Logos: small group prep (Logos Premium), sermon prep (Logos Pro), and academic and original language study (Logos Max).

What? So now as someone who is academic, a pastor, and one who leads small groups, he or she has to get more than one subscription to get the full use of new feature-sets? 

I think Nathanael King is right:

Logos is making a mistake moving to a (primarily?) subscription model that's going to hurt them long term.  People today have subscription fatigue and are much less likely to sign up if it's a subscription rather than a purchase.  With a purchase, you feel you're making an investment with every purchase.  With a subscription, you feel much less commitment to a product.  Since Logos is also continuing to sell resources, this makes their marketing far more confusing.  I imagine trying to explain to someone what they should buy and attaching a subscription to a commentary purchase makes it far less compelling.

The three subscription tiers are designed to fit the main ways people use Logos: small group prep (Logos Premium), sermon prep (Logos Pro), and academic and original language study (Logos Max).

What? So now as someone who is academic, a pastor, and one who leads small groups, he or she has to get more than one subscription to get the full use of new feature-sets? 

The subscription tiers will build on each other, so you can subscribe to the largest one that meets your needs (and get all the "lower" tiers included).

The subscription tiers will build on each other, so you can subscribe to the largest one that meets your needs (and get all the "lower" tiers included).

Will there be a discount on a one-year subscription like Logos Connect?

The subscription tiers will build on each other, so you can subscribe to the largest one that meets your needs (and get all the "lower" tiers included).

Will there be a discount on a one-year subscription like Logos Connect?

Somewhere in the megathread I believe Mark mentioned annual and possibly BiAnnual options being considered

Found it

Looks like Logos is following after Microsoft and  eventually everyone will have to move to Logos subscription plan. Or will there still be a 2 yr or 3 yr or whatever plan to update Logos non-subscription as it is now?

It's easy to miss it, but in my post I said:

We’re still thinking through what that means for purchasable feature sets, and we’d value your feedback on whether the option to purchase would be important to you, knowing that you’d miss out on all the AI and cloud-backed features along with regular updates. 

With regard to your other question:

And I would hope Logos considers annual payment for the subscription plan with a discount for the money being up front instead of monthly.

Yes, we hope to offer annual subscriptions at a discount and maybe even biannual ones at a greater discount. But that's unlikely to be during the early access period. We've got lots to add to Logos Pro and we want users to be clear about what they're getting before asking them to commit to a long period.

Thank you Bradley I didn't see that in the email or FAQ page, but that sounds good. 

I personally don't like subscriptions but if there is an "annual" or "biannual" discount option that has perpetual licensing, I guess it ends up being similar to the old way. The added benefit would be regular updates and access to features that can't be owned at the moment like AI stuff. It is a different model, but the outcome is close (at least appears to be in writing).

It would be nice to know more on the perpetual access. Is the license based on subscription time, price (accounting for discounts too), something else, or a combination? Also, I understand it is difficult to state what will be considered perpetual in the early stages, but are there classifications of features that will be considered "ownable" and others not (ex: outsourced [ex..the current AI tokens] vs insourced features)?

Again thank you.

It would be nice to know more on the perpetual access. Is the license based on subscription time, price (accounting for discounts too), something else, or a combination? Also, I understand it is difficult to state what will be considered perpetual in the early stages, but are there classifications of features that will be considered "ownable" and others not (ex: outsourced [ex..the current AI tokens] vs insourced features)?

We don't have firm details that we can share on this yet. There's still a lot of discussion happening internally (much of it due to the responses on this long forum thread) about how this will be managed. We hope to share more details over the coming months. 

Hey Mark,

I'm a retired data analyst.  I purchased and maintained Logos 7 to present. Please confirm my understanding of Logos long term marketing plan.

1.  If you don't have full-feature logos, get it now before all "features" are consumed by the subscription based usage plan.

2.  If you do have Logos 10 full-feature, be informed, all future "feature" upgrades will only be available via a subscription based plan(s).

I'm old school - sorry, I don't appreciate Microsoft Office 365.  I maintain the latest Microsoft Office Pro - so I'm not tied to an internet link, and more importantly, for security reasons there are some computer activities that are not allowed to have any external communication links.

That said, Logos serves two constituent groups.  A.  The professional academic who understands the software development process and cost associated with bring this product to the user.  B. The non-profit / religious entity (pastors / elders / deacons / lay leaders) who earns well below the mean income and has become accustom to non-profit pricing of Microsoft (which is a lose leader / philanthropic sector of an enormous organization).

Threading the marketing challenge between these two groups and staying in business becomes an oxymoron.  Neither group is large enough to grow (much less) sustain Logos, while a marketing plan that caters to one, offends the other. 

I love Logos software.  I spend several hours / day using it.  It has become an invaluable tool, like a phone or car.  I feel like I'm being backed into a corner, held hostage to the "cloud" based storage of my labor and now the fundamental core engine is becoming more and more dependent on internet continuity that is not conveniently backed up locally and dependent on Faithlife's ability to navigate the market and stay in business.  Should Faithlife fail or my ability to pay the monthly subscription - what happens to a lifetime of work?  How does one pass along any legacy?  My warm fuzzy confidence is waning.

Agreed.  Future purchasable features is a big one for me too. 

Agreed.  Future purchasable features is a big one for me too. 

Agreed.  Future purchasable features is a big one for me too. 

Agreed.  Future purchasable features is a big one for me too. 

Agreed.  Future purchasable features is a big one for me too. 

Agreed.  Future purchasable features is a big one for me too. 

Latest update from Bill McCarthy.  Good information.  They are still listening and trying to work things out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9uUnpHyJLA