Official: You Can Now Get Early Access to the Next Version of Logos
Later this year, we’ll launch the next version of Logos as a subscription. The subscription will have several tiers and eventually replace Preaching Suite, Faithlife Connect, and other Logos feature sets.
We’re living in a period of significant technological change, and only a subscription model enables us to continuously release new features and improvements as soon as they are built. Many of you don’t want to wait up to two years for improvements that could significantly benefit your Bible study. Subscription also allows us to include AI features which we can’t offer with permanent licenses due to the significant ongoing costs and rapidly changing technology.
Subscriptions aren’t required to maintain access to your existing content. They’re for those who want access to new and improved features. With Logos, your content investment is always safe, and you’ll always be able to access it for free. The subscription benefits listed above for features don’t apply to books in the same way, so we don’t foresee a time when we’ll stop selling perpetual licenses to books.
Can I get these subscriptions today?
One of the tiers of the forthcoming subscription will be called Logos Pro, and it will be aimed specifically at pastors. The full launch of these subscriptions won’t happen until later in the year, but if you own the Logos 10 Full Feature Set or subscribe to Faithlife Connect (excluding Starter and Mobile), you can get early access to Logos Pro today at a very special price.
Logos Pro includes most of the Logos 10 Full Feature Set, a library of more than 400 books to help you experience the power of Logos, and all the new features and improvements we’re developing for Logos 11. If you subscribe today, you’ll get five new features (Smart Search, Search Results Summaries, Summarization Sidebar, Sermon Assistant, and Instant Dark/Light Mode), and approximately once a quarter, we’ll add new and improved features to the subscription—not just this year, but every year.
How much will early access to Logos Pro cost?
Customers who own the Logos 10 Full Feature Set or subscribe to Faithlife Connect (excluding Starter and Mobile) can purchase the subscription for just $9.99/month. When Logos Pro launches in the fall with the other tiers of subscription, you’ll have the option to maintain your subscription to Logos Pro or switch to one of the other subscription tiers at a continued large discount.
How do I get it?
If you qualify, you can get early access to Logos Pro today at www.logos.com/early-access.
What is in Logos Pro?
We, and our beta testers, are excited by the features we’re adding to Logos Pro and later to the other subscription tiers. At the time of writing, Logos Pro includes most of the Logos 10 Full Feature Set, a library of more than 400 books to help you experience the power of Logos, and five new features described below. More features will be added regularly throughout the year and beyond.
Smart Search is a brand-new search engine built right into Logos. Just like the search engines you’re familiar with online, Smart Search doesn’t just search for the words in your query—it uses AI to search for articles that discuss the meaning of those words and then shows the most relevant place in that article in the search snippets. It makes searching your Logos library as easy as you’ve always hoped it would be.
Search Results Summaries allows you, with one click, to turn any brief search snippet into an AI-generated summary of the entire article, allowing you to better understand what each article covers, saving you time and helping you find the best content to dig into.
Summarization Sidebar enables you to use AI to summarize any article or chapter in almost any of your Logos books. The new Summarize tool can help you digest a lengthy article more quickly, simplify a complex article, or determine whether the full article is worth your time reading in full.
Sermon Assistant is an AI-powered tool that helps preachers overcome creative block and makes it easier to create materials to help the congregation better engage with the message. Currently:
- The Illustrations Generator suggests several short sermon illustrations you can use to explain doctrinal or other concepts.
- The Discussion Questions Generator takes a completed sermon and creates a series of discussion questions based on the sermon that could be used in a church bulletin or for small group, family, or personal study.
More than 400 commentaries, dictionaries, systematic theologies, journals, and other books to help you experience the distinctive power of Logos, including:
- 17 volumes of the Lexham Research Commentary series
- 10 volumes of the Spurgeon Commentary series
- 30 volumes of the Bible Study Magazine
- More than 350 additional volumes
Instant Dark/Light Mode allows you to switch between light and dark mode on desktop without requiring you to restart Logos.
And much more still to come!
That’s a lot of AI! Are all the new features going to be AI-powered?
We’re excited by the possibilities that AI—responsibly leveraged—brings to Logos, and we want to make the most of this technology. But we also want to equip you with the best tools for Bible study, using the most suitable technology for the task. So while there are plenty of AI-powered improvements in Logos Pro, and several more coming, we’ll also bring non-AI feature improvements, too.
Does AI really have a place in Bible study?
Christians have always been at the forefront of technology when it comes to accessing and understanding the Bible, whether adopting the codex in the second century or the printing press in the fifteenth. However, AI has limitations, fallibilities, and biases because it mirrors and sometimes amplifies those same weaknesses found in all human authors. That’s why Logos always lets you know when the content you’re reading is generated by AI. In addition, Logos’s AI tools are backed by your Logos library and designed to ensure AI is used responsibly and in a way appropriate for Bible study.
I don’t own the Logos 10 Full Feature Set. When can I subscribe to Logos Pro?
If you don’t own the Logos 10 Full Feature Set, you’ll be able to subscribe later in the year at a higher price. Or, you could purchase the Full Feature Upgrade now and immediately become eligible to subscribe at the discounted price.
Is early access to Logos Pro a beta program?
No. Each feature is beta-tested before it becomes part of Logos Pro. The purpose of early access is not for testing—it’s so that you can enjoy these new and improved features without waiting for the major release in the fall.
Can I cancel at any time?
Yes. Just visit https://www.logos.com/account/subscriptions.
Where does this leave subscriptions like Faithlife Connect and Preaching Suite?
The subscription that will launch later in the year will replace Faithlife Connect and Preaching Suite. The tier we're launching today, Logos Pro, includes exclusive new features, but there are a few tools and datasets in Connect and Preaching Suite that aren’t in Logos Pro but will be in another tier of the subscription. Most of the books in Logos Pro are different from those included in the existing subscriptions.
If you subscribe to those products, we’ll contact you later in the year to explain how you can painlessly switch to the new subscription. Until then, we recommend keeping your existing subscription to ensure you don’t lose any perks, features, or books. In the meantime, you could add Logos Pro to your existing subscription if you’re eligible.
Will I be forced to subscribe to Logos in the future? What about all the books I’ve already bought?
No one will be forced to subscribe to Logos to retain access to their existing content. You will always be able to access all the books you’ve purchased without further payment. Your books are your books. Subscriptions are for those who want access to the latest improvements, which aim to help you uncover deeper insights in less time.
Does this mean Logos will be subscription-only? Will I be able to buy Logos in the future?
Logos subscriptions aren’t new. More than ten thousand people have been subscribing to Logos for nearly a decade. But we’re now embracing subscription for our software because doing so has five distinct advantages.
- New users can have much lower upfront costs and try Logos with much less commitment.
- It allows us to continuously release new features and improvements as soon as they are built, rather than holding them back for a major release every two years. That’s especially important at a time of rapid technological change.
- It allows us to include features like AI, which we can’t offer permanent licenses to because of the significant ongoing costs.
- It’s a sustainable way of ensuring we can keep delivering improvements for decades to come.
- Releasing early and often significantly shortens the feedback loop, enabling us to continually tweak our improvements to ensure they’re really solving the most important things for all our customers.
With books, it’s different. The content of books isn’t continually improved—once they’re published, they’re done. And while we bear small ongoing costs to allow you to download and interact with your books, those costs are orders of magnitude lower than that of AI and similar services. Therefore, you will still be able to buy permanent access to Logos libraries and any other books from our catalog. In the future, we may add rental options for those who want it, but we don’t foresee a time when we’ll stop selling perpetual licenses to books.
We’re still thinking through what that means for purchasable feature sets, and we’d value your feedback on whether the option to purchase would be important to you, knowing that you’d miss out on all the AI and cloud-backed features along with regular updates.
We’re excited about the benefits of a Logos subscription. We’re already building new features and improvements that will be released in the coming months, and we can’t wait to share them with early access customers soon and the rest of our users in the fall.
If you’re eligible and want to subscribe, visit www.logos.com/early-access.
Comments
- Sharing documents
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Mark, I've had Logos since 1995, when it was QuickVerse, and watched it develop over time. I use it everyday and am concerned with the subscription model and features; how much is lost if there is no Internet connection? Thanks for the great program that has been put together. I own the Silver Edition, Logos Full Feature Set. 😎
Logos was never QuickVerse, that was whole different company & software.
Here is an older message from Bob P. when he still owned Logos...
When we started there were lots of DOS programs, and soon many Windows ones... QuickVerse, Ask God, BibleWindows, GRAMCORD, Wordsearch, CDWordLibrary, Online Bible, PC Study Bible, etc.
...I use it everyday and am concerned with the subscription model and features; how much is lost if there is no Internet connection? Thanks for the great program that has been put together. I own the Silver Edition, Logos Full Feature Set.
If you mean working offline then search the Logos Help manual for "Net" as those features will require the Internet whether you subscribe or not.
To find features that require AI/online, then search for "AI Credits" as these also require a subscription.
Dave
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Windows 11 & Android 13
May I ask
It says that if I keep logos 10 subscription for 2 years
What do I get to keep ?
Is it an actual logos 10 program? Do I get to keep feature sets? Like gold?
Can anyone help me understand
I can't find what data sets are included
Features sets like read aloud mobile app or sermon builder
And what in liners
I can't find any list
What do I get to keep ?
See my reply at https://community.logos.com/forums/t/224151.aspx
I can't find any list
There is no list. You will know know after 2 years, but have a pretty good idea during that time.
Dave
===
Windows 11 & Android 13
There is no list. You will know know after 2 years, but have a pretty good idea during that time.
And this is still a massive PR problem - Subscribe and turn the handle like the old gumball machines to find out what you get....
Hopefully we will get an accurate list of included features for each subscription option, as well as a well defined list of what would be kept after two years of payments.... Somewhere in the posts, Mark in some way admitted that he's not sure what's coming in the future - so as has been said elsewhere by others - users could wind up with zero to keep for their investment....
***Found it -
Another question that may be good to have the answer to before launch.....Yes. Let's say you subscribe to Logos Pro for one year, and then upgrade to Logos Max.
After two years, you'll be eligible for a Logos Pro fallback license. After a further year, that would get upgraded to a Logos Max fallback license.
I doubt that there would be an option to pay the difference, but we're two years away from that being an issue, so I can't be dogmatic. I appreciate that puts L10 full-feature set owners wanting to get the most value from the fallback license in something of a quandary. Do you pay for Logos Max from day one, even though there's not much difference between that and Logos Pro right now, in the hope that it will snag you a better fallback license in two years' time?
No one can answer that question because no one knows (not even me!) exactly what might go into Logos Max over the next two years.
As of now - for your up to $260 investment (if you have the discount) - you get to keep instant dark/light mode.... Anything else? That's right - it's being "worked on"
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
As of now - for your up to $260 investment (if you have the discount) - you get to keep instant dark/light mode.... Anything else? That's right - it's being "worked on"
Keep in mind that everything available now is either previously released or early access. The full releases aren't going to happen until October or so, so hopefully at that point there will be a decent selection of new features. In all fairness though, if someone doesn't have the full feature set now or a Connect subscription, subscribing now would give them a decent amount of new features.
Disclaimer: I hate using messaging, texting, and email for real communication. If anything that I type to you seems like anything other than humble and respectful, then I have not done a good job typing my thoughts.
I think that the word we've been given (or at least what I've understood) is that we do not need to panic-buy the full feature set, that an opportunity to buy it will be given when the new subscriptions are released in the fall. If that's the case, then everyone will be able to assess the best way for each to proceed.
Pastor, Cornerstone Baptist Church, Clinton, SC
"With books, it’s different. The content of books isn’t continually improved—once they’re published, they’re done. And while we bear small ongoing costs to allow you to download and interact with your books, those costs are orders of magnitude lower than that of AI and similar services. Therefore, you will still be able to buy permanent access to Logos libraries and any other books from our catalog. In the future, we may add rental options for those who want it, but we don’t foresee a time when we’ll stop selling perpetual licenses to books.
We’re still thinking through what that means for purchasable feature sets, and we’d value your feedback on whether the option to purchase would be important to you, knowing that you’d miss out on all the AI and cloud-backed features along with regular updates."
Where can I give my feedback on this? I would love the ability to buy instead of rent features (I really dislike subscriptions, and without an option to buy, I would be much more hesitant to recommend Logos to others). Also, you mention that the books we have will remain, but what about our feature expansions?
Thanks!
Where can I give my feedback on this?
You just have done [:)].
Since this post, we have announced that people switching to a subscription from Logos 10 would qualify for a Legacy Fallback License after two years. That means that if you were to cancel your subscription after the two-year period, you'd retain permanent access to non-AI and non-Cloud features that were part of your subscription.
Where can I give my feedback on this?You just have done
.
Since this post, we have announced that people switching to a subscription from Logos 10 would qualify for a Legacy Fallback License after two years. That means that if you were to cancel your subscription after the two-year period, you'd retain permanent access to non-AI and non-Cloud features that were part of your subscription.
Does this fallback license apply to Faithlife Connect subscribers as well, or would we need to purchase the full feature set to have access to the fallback license?
I really would like the option to upgrade my logos with the new features as you have been offering previously. Allow me to purchase the features every year or every two years if that is the case. Those that want them sooner let them get them sooner. Those that are willing to wait for new features should be allowed to wait and purchase later.
I really would like the option to upgrade my logos with the new features as you have been offering previously.
Not going to happen! The only concession is for those who subscribe for 2years as they can keep the non-cloud features in their tier (e.g. Pro, Max).
If you do the Math, however, it will cost you $260 for two years discount subscription to Max. New users (no discount) will pay $700.
If you have to purchase L!0 Full Features for the discount add that to the $260 and see if you are still ahead! If not, you will be ahead after the second and subsequent years.
Dave
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Windows 11 & Android 13
Not going to happen!
I think based on some conversations.... if the customer base does not "fall in line" and users hold out spending - there will be a reconsideration of the silly stance Logos has taken - it really makes no sense to not offer the traditional option. Mark's only argument when some of us pointed out that if the two year fallback can be purchased up front, there is no reason to not offer the traditional option was - we would miss out on the AI and online perks of subscription. I don't recall him answering the question in response to that, what if a user is OK without those things....
So, if users that do not want to subscribe "vote" with their wallets and they truly do not want to lose customers - the common sense decision would be to give the users want they want - after all, the users ARE the reason the company still exists.
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
Mark, how about subscriptions for laymen like me? Will I get the new features as soon as they are out? What are the advantages, and how much will it cost me (monthly or yearly)? Will smart search be available to us too?
Thanks,
Joseph
Mark, how about subscriptions for laymen like me? Will I get the new features as soon as they are out? What are the advantages, and how much will it cost me (monthly or yearly)? Will smart search be available to us too?
Thanks,
Joseph
Are you a Connect subscriber. or do you own the Full Feature Set for Logos 10?
If so, Logos Premium would be $6.99/month or $69,99/yr; Logos Pro would be $9.99/month or $99.99/yr; and Logos Max would be $12.99/month or $129.99/yr.
If you are not a subscriber now and do not own the FFS, then it would pay in the long run to buy the Full Feature Set at the discount now offered.
Mark, how about subscriptions for laymen like me? Will I get the new features as soon as they are out? What are the advantages, and how much will it cost me (monthly or yearly)? Will smart search be available to us too?
There are currently three tiers available: one aimed at lay leaders, one aimed at pastors, and one aimed at those who want to go deep into the original languages. It's possible that in the future, we might add an additional tier below all these aimed at lay people.
That said, lay people who like to go deep into their study will sometimes be using very similar study methods to lay leaders, pastors, or academics. If that's you, you might be better off with Logos Premium, Logos Pro, or Logos Max. You should see pricing at https://www.logos.com/early-access/subscriptions
Hi Mark
May I offer to help you beta test new features in the future please? I continue to hope you can scale down with what I would call "easy access" so newbies and casual users can make use of Logos and all its features. Some of the more specialized stuff you all do so well is lost on me but accessing things that a common everyday Logos user say in a group bible study might use - would be nice.
Respectfully,
Joshua Lieder
This has probably already been asked, but is Logos/Faithlife committing to permanently supporting the existing version in regards to defects and security problems? Or is support going to end for the existing (purchased) software at some point?
It's a bit disingenuous to say "you keep your books," when the only way to access those books is through what will ultimately be a non-operational, potentially insecure piece of software.
Once you go to subscriptions, it looks like you're going to stop selling access to individual books. At least that's the implication of the "levels" you're offering. Is this true?
And one more ... Once you go to subscriptions, it looks like you're going to stop selling access to individual books. At least that's the implication of the "levels" you're offering. Is this true?
I'm sorry and I don't mean to offend, but where on earth are you getting that from? Logos is a book seller. They're not going to stop selling books. That's their main source of revenue.
I'm not thrilled with the idea of another subscription, though the deal has gotten sweeter and I probably will eventually go for it. But some of the fears that have been expressed in this season are... let me find the right way to express this... rather far disconnected from the realities of the situation.
And one more ... Once you go to subscriptions, it looks like you're going to stop selling access to individual books. At least that's the implication of the "levels" you're offering. Is this true?I'm sorry and I don't mean to offend, but where on earth are you getting that from? Logos is a book seller. They're not going to stop selling books. That's their main source of revenue.
I'm getting this from reading the information about the subscription service. There's nothing in there about new books, just about the books you will get with the subscription.
What if selling the subscription becomes a larger source of revenue than selling books? Is Logos/Faithlife committed, for the long haul, to keeping existing user investments in place--even if it's no longer making them money?
Overall, I don't just dislike subscription services, I also dislike cloud-based services in theory and practice.
I'm not sure "disingenuous" is a proper characterization. Logos has said repeatedly that they have no plans of going away, that they are committed to a generational presence which means that your books will be available to you for as long as they can see. I can't speak about security issues. I also think that it would go without saying that anyone who buys a digital book nowadays does so with the understanding that using a digital book is wholly dependent on the software needed to read it, and that software updates are part of using digital resources. This is true of Logos, Kindle, PDFs, Word files, etc.
I also think that it would go without saying that anyone who buys a digital book nowadays does so with the understanding that using a digital book is wholly dependent on the software needed to read it, and that software updates are part of using digital resources. This is true of Logos, Kindle, PDFs, Word files, etc.
I would really like to believe this is the case, but it often isn't in the real world. It costs money to keep software updated. New operating systems need to be supported. Code gets old. I know the costs involved as I work in IT. I've lost books (and other media) I purchased in other formats because the reader software was simply no longer supported.
It's easy to say "we're going to do this." It's harder to actually do it.
Hasn't Logos already bucked this trend by providing free OS and security updates to people who did not buy the upgraded versions? I can't run Word 95 on Windows 11 without buying something new. But if I had never upgraded Logos, I could still be on build 35 without spending any other money.I would really like to believe this is the case, but it often isn't in the real world. It costs money to keep software updated. New operating systems need to be supported. Code gets old. I know the costs involved as I work in IT. I've lost books (and other media) I purchased in other formats because the reader software was simply no longer supported.
It's easy to say "we're going to do this." It's harder to actually do it.
Using Logos as a pastor, seminary professor, and Tyndale author
Hey, I have subscribed and am liking it so far, but my biggest issue with subscriptions is paying for a long time and not owning it. I seem to remember when signing up something saying that if I pay for two years, I no longer have to pay to keep the logos 11 features? Is my memory playing tricks on me or is this reality?
https://www.logos.com/early-access/subscriptions
It's called the Legacy Fallback License. You can keep features that are not AI or cloud-based.
Pastor, Mt. Leonard Baptist Church, SBC
I have two basic problems with the direction Logos is going here.
First, I've been in IT for 30+ years (rule11.tech, rule11.ac). I know a lot of the folks in this forum have little exposure to my world, but I can tell you there is no instance of a company going to a subscription model that does not eventually tie content as well as services to the subscription. It's a sheer matter of finances. The fine folks at Faithlife can swear to me, up, down, and sideways, that there will never be a day when I cannot access content I have purchased, or that all actual content will be purchasable. They can swear they will forever maintain a version of Logos to access the materials with all the features that exist today.
It's not that think anyone is lying about this. Faithlife truly believes it will be possible to maintain a subscription service and purchased content "forever." But I don't know of a single instance in the history of IT where a company offering a subscription service has not put their efforts into that service, eventually failing to support software they sold in the past. Operating systems are updated. Security and other defects will be discovered (although Faithlife has never, ever, taken user security and privacy seriously). The funding for these things will dry up as the subscription model takes off and drives corporate revenue.
You still "own" every Word document you have ever written. Accessing those documents, however, becomes harder and harder every year without subscribing to a service. Ownership is meaningless if the data can only be accessed via a subscription service.
In almost every instance, support for the older, non-subscription software will be moved to some "less expensive part of the world," and support will become sketchy. Eventually, the company decides taking the "black eye" of just not supporting expensive to support software that generates lower amounts of company income is worth it.
I've never seen this not happen. It's not a matter of intentions. It's not a matter of wanting to do the right thing. It's always, in every case, a matter of leaning into financial realities.
I wish I could be confident this will never happen, but I don't see how to avoid it once you start down the subscription path. I'm not the only one who thinks this, btw ... Christians in the tech world are a shy group. I've received emails from a few different people in the tech world who are serious students of the Scriptures who are already looking for an alternative to Logos. I know some who are exporting their Logos library into other formats to make certain they can keep access to their most important books. They all know electronic media provided on a subscription basis is often stealth edited.
Second, I really object to dividing people between "professionals" and "others" in the way this is being done. Stop treating lay people as dumb. Stop treating them as "second class." I've left four churches in the Knoxville area because I was told: "theology belongs in a classroom, not in the pew," "God doesn't call smart people," and "you cannot build a big church if you expect the average person in the pew to be smart, and we want to save as many people as possible, so we want to build a big church."
I've yet to find the commandment in the Scriptures to "go forth and build a big church by not teaching them theology because they might leave." This entire separation between the "dumb congregant" and the "smart pastor" encourages this sort of thinking. I earned/hold an MACM from STS, and a Ph.D. from SEBTS (apologetics and culture). I am a member of EPS. I attend EPS/ETS at least once every 2-3 years. I am a published author in the Christian (and technical) worlds. I write a substack on theology and culture.
I have no interest in being a pastor, but I think every single Christian should be theologically informed.
And here is Faithlife saying: "Everyone should not understand the scriptures on the same level. Non-professionals just don't need to understand the Scriptures as well as professionals."
I find this entire move to subscription ill-founded and distasteful. I suppose we will not know if this is going to "work" or not is to wait ten years or so, and see how well the non-subscription part of the software is maintained ... but by then, if it doesn't work, it will be too late to go back. I will, probably, on a personal level, start exporting the most important books in my library to some other format so I have a "safe backup" of the books I have purchased through Faithlife. That might seem a little "extreme," but I just don't think I have another choice.
You can't point to the subscription model as an eventuality, not as long as the company has other ways to drive revenue and people are more devoted to it. I think it's more than likely people will decide they would rather take books and can't consistently stick with the subscription model themselves. I wonder, hypothetically, if Logos decided this model didn't work out, how might they backpedal.
Anyway, I wouldn't be concerned about the idea of different subscription tiers being used to divide people with different levels of training. I'm a layperson, and I've got my eyes on the silver feature package. I would be concerned with the predetermined form of what's on offer, and the big difference between what's offered on the three tiers being presented now, the rigidity and the predetermined nature of them. I think I would need more than one tier, but not as much as another. I think the idea was to facilitate people changing subscription tiers from months to month as rolls and needs change. I still say the best thing to do is to do the best you can to sort out which level of Logos itself you want and go for it.
I have two basic problems with the direction Logos is going here.
Back when folks would wonder about large sums for digital, Faithlife would always reassure concerning the finances. But I always thought, new ownership would be the problem. In our little tourist burg, people bewail the cost of homes, but say nothing to its cause ... new ownership. Sellers want pay ... new owners need revenue. There's no magic.
I'm age-wise at the end of my planned investment. Even unloading my Chicago Assyrian set. But for younger folks, is the large investments wise? If I were turning the clock back (and today's Logos). I'd stick with what I call a Bibleworks type library (or basic Accordance). But I doubt most will read the tea leaves. 30% off!
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
Faithlife truly believes it will be possible to maintain a subscription service and purchased content "forever." But I don't know of a single instance in the history of IT where a company offering a subscription service has not put their efforts into that service, eventually failing to support software they sold in the past. Operating systems are updated. Security and other defects will be discovered (although Faithlife has never, ever, taken user security and privacy seriously). The funding for these things will dry up as the subscription model takes off and drives corporate revenue.
I'll give you an example of such a thing I've experienced as it relates to Logos. It doesn't involve subscriptions, but it does involve Logos resources I've purchased in the past that I can no longer access.
Over 20 years ago, I purchased a CD-ROM by Galaxie Software called the Theological Journal Library. This contains a compilation of theological journals to be accessed within Logos Bible Software. At the time of the purchase, version 2 of Logos was in use, and the resource files were compatible with both version 2 as well as the later Libronix version. Unlike up-to-date editions of the journals that are available individually by year on Logos' web site, these early versions of the journals I purchased at the time were compilations of journals spanning multiple years per each theological journal resource. For example, included in the library was the Grace Theological Journal, a compilation of journals from 1960-1991 within a single resource (unlike going on the web site and obtaining newer versions of the same journals that are made available individually by volume).
As later versions of Logos were released, they converted some of those theological journal resources I purchased to be compatible with the later Logos versions, but they didn't convert all of them. This meant that although I could access all of the journals I had from the Galaxie Software resource back in version 2 and Libronix, I could only access some of them in later editions of Logos.
I contacted Faithlife's support regarding all of this. They confirmed that I had these resources unlocked, and I provided proof to them that I had access to only some of those journals now but not all of them (I provided screenshots of the resources I could access in the library, screenshots of resources not showing up in the library when I type in the resource name in the search field for the library, and I provided them the Logos version 2 files of the journals that I could not access and that were not converted for later versions of Logos). After back and forth e-mails over a span of a few months, Faithlife's support finally told me the following:
Keep in mind not all the resources that were available in Logos 2 will be compatible with the current software. As this seems to be the case, if nothing changes after scanning the CDs, sadly, that means these resources are not compatible or available in the current version of Logos.
They didn't even offer to provide me the current versions of those same journals that are available to be purchased on the web site and that are available separately by year. So the end result is that I no longer have access to some of the journals that I purchased years ago. This didn't sit well with me at all, and I'm not happy with Faithlife.
The title of this thread is "Official: You Can Now Get Early Access to the Next Version of Logos," and began with Mark Barnes (Logos) posting on 6 March 2024 about the new subscription model.
I think we can all agree that the discussion that followed has drifted off topic and gone down a number of rabbit holes since then. To put it mildly.
It would help everyone if we could stick to the original topic, or if there are other important issues, simply start a new thread.
Just sayin'
My only concern is whether or not my Logos 10 will be cut off in the future.
I want to be able to use my Logos in places where there is no internet. I have already run into this problem with other programs. They have stopped running when I am in places where I can not "confirm" my identity even though I have had the program since it was originally loaded with a hard disk.
So as long as I can keep running Logos 10 offline, subscriptions are okay with me. ]Many of the features that require constant updating, I haven't learned to use yet].
I think there are two problems here.
I know what Logos has promised in relation to existing resources. I also know what has happened to these promises by every other company moving to a subscription model. My experience with Logos over the years does not encourage me to think: "they're different than other companies."
Edit -- the naming used to describe access to existing resources is Legacy Fallback. For anyone who isn't in IT, "legacy" means that which costs you money but doesn't add value, and hence is not going to be supported in the future, and "fallback" means that which you use when nothing else works as a temporary solution. The naming is indicative of what is coming in the future, regardless of what is being promised today.
I am also worried about buying and accessing resources released in the future without a subscription. A new set of journals come out every year. How long will I be able to buy and access them without a subscription? I suspect the answer is: "until we change the book format to support some new AI sermon-writing thingie, and then all new books will be in that format, and you'll be forced to buy a subscription to get the updated software that works with this new format."
If Logos had a basic set of tools supported only by ongoing book purchases including search and "cited by," I would buy that. All the AI sermon writing, prayer journal (which is private and shouldn't be in Logos in the first place), sermon notes (again, private, and shouldn't be kept in an insecure piece of software like Logos), and the rest are just not interesting. I'd rather keep those things in a format that I don't lose if I ever stop using Logos, and in software managed by folks who take my privacy and security seriously.
I'm not interested in a subscription to get new features. If I'm forced to buy a subscription to continue purchasing updated and new books, I'll have to rethink using Logos at all.
Subscription fatigue is real.
Shalom Russ,
I am also worried about buying and accessing resources released in the future without a subscription.
This is what Mark Barnes wrote on page 1 of this thread:
With books, it’s different. The content of books isn’t continually improved—once they’re published, they’re done. And while we bear small ongoing costs to allow you to download and interact with your books, those costs are orders of magnitude lower than that of AI and similar services. Therefore, you will still be able to buy permanent access to Logos libraries and any other books from our catalog. In the future, we may add rental options for those who want it, but we don’t foresee a time when we’ll stop selling perpetual licenses to books.
Subscription fatigue is real.
I am not an IT professional but I get the impression that "traditional" pc software (i.e. that will work offline) is increasingly losing ground to SAAS. For example, the church management system my church uses has been cloud based since 2011 and access to digital hymnals is also often on the basis of a yearly subscription.
In general I do not like subscriptions but Logos (Connect) is one of the few exceptions.
With books, it’s different. The content of books isn’t continually improved—once they’re published, they’re done. And while we bear small ongoing costs to allow you to download and interact with your books, those costs are orders of magnitude lower than that of AI and similar services. Therefore, you will still be able to buy permanent access to Logos libraries and any other books from our catalog. In the future, we may add rental options for those who want it, but we don’t foresee a time when we’ll stop selling perpetual licenses to books.
'Foresee'. 'Foreseeable.' And 'we' ... we's change unavoidably. I don't doubt that Logos can't long-withstand financials vs industry trends. But I suspect, long before that, the penchant to buy digital licenses (books) will be impacted by the penchant to cancel subscriptions (so easy). In my own case, the negativity toward no-subscribe impacts my penchant to buy from Faithlife. I don't think that negativity is going to work well for FL Marketing.
"If myth is ideology in narrative form, then scholarship is myth with footnotes." B. Lincolm 1999.
Edit -- the naming used to describe access to existing resources is Legacy Fallback. For anyone who isn't in IT, "legacy" means that which costs you money but doesn't add value, and hence is not going to be supported in the future, and "fallback" means that which you use when nothing else works as a temporary solution. The naming is indicative of what is coming in the future, regardless of what is being promised today.
Counterpoint: that's a specialised meaning of the word from the IT domain (as you've admitted) that you're reading into the announcement.
In non-IT circles, it's much more often used to mean "something from the past with long-lasting impact". See "Legacy Standard Bible", "Logos 9 Legacy Libraries", "spiritual legacy", etc. Sometimes the plain meaning of the text is what's intended. 😀
So "legacy fallback" means, in your view, "that which will stand forever because it's the position you fall back to whenever all else fails." :-)
If FL were saying: "we're going to continue our current model and add additional features as part of a new subscription in addition to the current model," I'd say, "great, let's see what features might be useful." What they are saying instead is: "This is the new way. The old way is now the fallback. We think we will be able to support the old content forever based on our current financials, but the way we are going to support ourselves now is through subscription-based software and content."
I know a lot of people here love FL, and think FL is the greatest company on the face of the Earth, etc. My past experiences with FL as a company are negative enough that I don't consider FL any sort of "special organization."
In non-IT circles, it's much more often used to mean "something from the past with long-lasting impact"
But I thought the "Legacy fallback license" was for previous owners of L10 FFS to obtain a permanent (vs unowned) license to the new features over the next 2 years? So is it not the customer that is being called "legacy"? Legacy customers are those who purchased everything BEFORE the transition to subscription only.
A question still in my mind, but I have not seen addressed yet is ... after the two year period ... will another 2 year period begin? And How will that work for new customers? Will they be able to ever own the new features from the previous 2 years?
Mark, thank you for the detailed explanation. I have a suggestion. With so many apps going to the subscription model, many of us are facing subscription fatigue. May I humbly but urgently ask that you consider including Logos in Setapp? Logos will still receive a subscription for each person who uses the app in Setup and would likely pick up new customers that would be missed otherwise.
Mark, thank you for the detailed explanation. I have a suggestion. With so many apps going to the subscription model, many of us are facing subscription fatigue. May I humbly but urgently ask that you consider including Logos in Setapp? Logos will still receive a subscription for each person who uses the app in Setup and would likely pick up new customers that would be missed otherwise.
Setapp is not made for subscriptions like Logos and there is no way they would get nearly enough money from each subscription using such a platform.
Mark, thank you for the detailed explanation. I have a suggestion. With so many apps going to the subscription model, many of us are facing subscription fatigue. May I humbly but urgently ask that you consider including Logos in Setapp? Logos will still receive a subscription for each person who uses the app in Setup and would likely pick up new customers that would be missed otherwise.
Setapp is not made for subscriptions like Logos and there is no way they would get nearly enough money from each subscription using such a platform.
I'm writing with feedback that you requested in your post and a couple questions regarding subscriptions. You said "We’re still thinking through what that means for purchasable feature sets, and we’d value your feedback on whether the option to purchase would be important to you." I think the Legacy Fallback is a great solution. I regularly use sermon builder and sermon manager and am glad I own them as I have fully integrated with these and would want to know I own them for the long term, even if I stop subscription (I assume items like these are included). This is one reason I bought the full feature set and I would recommend to others who are only starting with Logos after transition. One question. I asked one a Logos affiliate whether there will be any free monthly books life Faithlife connect and they said Pro includes a 4th extra free book of the month (not from Classics series). Where do I access this? They also said subscription includes 5% storewide discount and 5% annual cash back. Are these automatically applied? Thanks!
I'm writing with feedback that you requested in your post and a couple questions regarding subscriptions. You said "We’re still thinking through what that means for purchasable feature sets, and we’d value your feedback on whether the option to purchase would be important to you." I think the Legacy Fallback is a great solution. I regularly use sermon builder and sermon manager and am glad I own them as I have fully integrated with these and would want to know I own them for the long term, even if I stop subscription (I assume items like these are included). This is one reason I bought the full feature set and I would recommend to others who are only starting with Logos after transition. One question. I asked one a Logos affiliate whether there will be any free monthly books life Faithlife connect and they said Pro includes a 4th extra free book of the month (not from Classics series). Where do I access this? They also said subscription includes 5% storewide discount and 5% annual cash back. Are these automatically applied? Thanks!
It might be a good idea, but two years? I'm pretty sure that in light of what's on offer, I can't even find the motivation to sustain this subscription for that long consecutively, never mind the budget considerations. I'm not sure this means the best thing for consumers or as a business model. I've never been crazy about what seems to me like a "three sizes fit some" subscription model. The lack of involved seems to be the basis for justifying this, and indeed, the basis for this. We don't even know what the company is going to want to do when two years is over.
I asked one a Logos affiliate whether there will be any free monthly books life Faithlife connect and they said Pro includes a 4th extra free book of the month (not from Classics series). Where do I access this? They also said subscription includes 5% storewide discount and 5% annual cash back. Are these automatically applied? Thanks!
Right now, the subscription is still in the early access period. Not all the perks will be available until the subscription launches fully in the fall.
Mark,
When using the subscription, how much of Logos can't you use when the Internet goes down, or if you are in an area with poor reception?
On desktop, the vast majority works offline, assuming you have all your books downloaded. Mobile is heavily limited when offline.
You can open the Help Manual and use CTRL+F to find the text "[Net]" to find features that require an internet connection. A quick look at that suggests:
There may be a few more not documented, but that's certainly most of what requires a connection.
When using the subscription, how much of Logos can't you use when the Internet goes down, or if you are in an area with poor reception?
In addition, your application will need to run online once each time your subscription renews (whatever your renewal period is) in order to download the updated licenses. Without those updated licenses, the application will not know that you still have a license to any of the features, datasets, or books included in the subscription.
Andrew Batishko | Logos software developer
Ok, too much to read to know if this has been answered. I am a vested owner with logos 10 full features platinum or higher.
1-If I go to early trial of subscription max, will it have all features available to try out?
2-for someone like me, is the new subscription model simply giving me access to the upgraded features and really no books? If so, I assume that I’m just paying 129 a year for the upgraded features. Is this the upgrade and subscription in a nutshell for guys like me that already own so many books have full features
Ok, too much to read to know if this has been answered. I am a vested owner with logos 10 full features platinum or higher.
1-If I go to early trial of subscription max, will it have all features available to try out?
2-for someone like me, is the new subscription model simply giving me access to the upgraded features and really no books? If so, I assume that I’m just paying 129 a year for the upgraded features. Is this the upgrade and subscription in a nutshell for guys like me that already own so many books have full features
1 - Yes
2 - The new subscription model will give you all of the latest features (those released after L10) as well as the right to purchase the latest base package libraries (~L11 or whatever they will be called). The books included with the subscription are a bonus, but may not be that helpful if you already have a huge library.
2 - The new subscription model will give you all of the latest features (those released after L10) as well as the right to purchase the latest base package libraries (~L11 or whatever they will be called). The books included with the subscription are a bonus, but may not be that helpful if you already have a huge library.
Which also implies that at some point in the future folks on the legacy fallback plan will not be able to "purchase" new resources. Not that I understand what it means to "purchase" resources in a world where you can only access them via subscription.
This is exactly how abandoning the non-subscription users starts.
Which also implies that at some point in the future folks on the legacy fallback plan will not be able to "purchase" new resources.
You might want to double-check this. IIRC Mark indicated even the free version was a sufficient base to purchase books. It is the biannual libraries that have restrictions but the restrictions are a continuation of the current restrictions.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
Which also implies that at some point in the future folks on the legacy fallback plan will not be able to "purchase" new resources.
They are never going to stop selling licenses to resources. That would not make any sense whatsoever. What concerns me though is that they may start Leasing those same resources as a subscription, which would give new users, a much better deal than the longtime loyal customers got by paying for it outright.
Need some help. I have Logos Max Subscription but the Bible Study Builder tool says it isn't available. What am I doing wrong?
Need some help. I have Logos Max Subscription but the Bible Study Builder tool says it isn't available. What am I doing wrong?
What platform is this on Mike?
And what version of Logos are you running?
I have Logos Max Subscription but the Bible Study Builder tool says it isn't available.
The Bible Study Builder hasn't been released yet in a stable version. It's still in beta.
Need some help. I have Logos Max Subscription but the Bible Study Builder tool says it isn't available. What am I doing wrong?
I could be wrong, but there are two things regarding BSB:
1. It is in beta, so you will need to be on the beta testing track.
2. You need to follow the Logos Pro (Early Access) group at Faithlife.com
Need some help. I have Logos Max Subscription but the Bible Study Builder tool says it isn't available. What am I doing wrong?
Apprehension Regarding Subscription Service
You mention I will get 200-500 new books which will enhance the data matching of AI but will we have any say in the books? I'm not interested in certain schools of theology and if their books are included I foresee me spending more time exegeting your AI's output than the scriptures themselves.
Welcome to the forums and thanks for sharing your reaction. Relax. If you chose to run AI assisted searches, which is a personal choice, you can run it against your own choice of a collection of books. This allows you to get results without worrying about "contaminated" results any more than you do now.
your sentence diagramming was on par with Biblearc.
This can easily be done in Logos but is limited in automation due to copyright issues I have heard from outside sources which may not the reliable.
Orthodox Bishop Alfeyev: "To be a theologian means to have experience of a personal encounter with God through prayer and worship."; Orthodox proverb: "We know where the Church is, we do not know where it is not."
Slightly off this threads topic...
I had to abandon Adobe and have lost my passion for photography as a result. I still shoot but now I have settled for the camera to just process the photo into jpgs and use inadequate filters to process the photos while damaging the files.
Hi Jim,
This is in no way a response to your Logos question, but instead a suggestion for your Photo editing. You might want to take a look at Capture One.
You can subscribe to it, but you can also but a perpetual license for it. It is similar to Lightroom. I use it to shoot tethered. I like it anyway.
Now back to our regularly scheduled thread topic...
Slightly off this threads topic...
I had to abandon Adobe and have lost my passion for photography as a result. I still shoot but now I have settled for the camera to just process the photo into jpgs and use inadequate filters to process the photos while damaging the files.Hi Jim,
This is in no way a response to your Logos question, but instead a suggestion for your Photo editing. You might want to take a look at Capture One.
You can subscribe to it, but you can also but a perpetual license for it. It is similar to Lightroom. I use it to shoot tethered. I like it anyway.
Now back to our regularly scheduled thread topic...
For free open source GIMP is used as a Photoshop alternative and is held with high regard. Darktable is another, though I've not tried that one yet.
Logos 10 - OpenSuse Tumbleweed, Windows 11, Android 16 & Android 14
Slightly off this threads topic...
I had to abandon Adobe and have lost my passion for photography as a result. I still shoot but now I have settled for the camera to just process the photo into jpgs and use inadequate filters to process the photos while damaging the files.Hi Jim,
This is in no way a response to your Logos question, but instead a suggestion for your Photo editing. You might want to take a look at Capture One.
You can subscribe to it, but you can also but a perpetual license for it. It is similar to Lightroom. I use it to shoot tethered. I like it anyway.
Now back to our regularly scheduled thread topic...
For free open source GIMP is used as a Photoshop alternative and is held with high regard. Darktable is another, though I've not tried that one yet.
For what it's worth, I've recently purchased ACDSee Ultimate as an alternative to Photoshop. It too comes with both a subscription and a perpetual license option, and looks like a good alternative (though I'm still a real newbie at digital photography post-processing).
Is the Free Version of Logos going away? The Free version I have been using going to stop working?
Is the Free Version of Logos going away? The Free version I have been using going to stop working?
No, it's not. The free version will remain available to use, will go onworking and will contiue to be updated.
Have joy in the Lord!
I am a part-time minister who uses Logos for both my personal study and sermon prep. For awhile now I have been wanting to purchase the "Logos 10 Silver Feature upgrade." I am wanting to do so for some of the exclusive iPad features this enables in logos. There are also some interlinears and datasets included, which I am wanting.
The $300+ dollars is what has prevented me from making this purchase. Now I am wondering whether this is my last chance to get these features without having to enroll in an ongoing subscription model (which I prefer not to do).
So, will I lose the option to purchase these features if I don't do so now?
Mark has made clear elsewhere that there will be plenty of notice for users to purchase feature sets if they choose before they are cut off. It is also possible that they will go on a final sale before you lose the opportunity.
Disclaimer: I hate using messaging, texting, and email for real communication. If anything that I type to you seems like anything other than humble and respectful, then I have not done a good job typing my thoughts.