Microsoft Surface
Comments
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Dave. I am hoping for an inexpensive tablet that runs all of Logos 5 efficiently just like my laptop. I really am not confused despite NOT using the right lingo here.
I can say I own a go-cart and it runs - but I defy anyone to tell me I should put it on the highway and try to change lanes [:)]
We really want Logos to put full functionality into its new Windows version of the app so split screens and similar working features are there.
Touch functionality is almost non-existant from what I have read.
Not having highlighting in the app is a major - forget it and wait - concern for me.
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a 7 inch tablet is NOT good news, sorry.[:(]
Too small a screen. I want my Tablet screen to do it all with touch functionality from within the app!!!!!
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a 7 inch tablet is NOT good news, sorry.
Too small a screen. I want my Tablet screen to do it all with touch functionality from within the app!!!!!
You might be surprised--the iPad mini has a 7.9" screen and is quite capable.
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How can I justify such a huge expense on this Tablet?
Does the stylus underline well in the reader at least?
Will it mirror what my Windows Laptop does well or does it hesitate?
Anyone care to comment on the low volume for media please?
Also, why is the back of this product always hot?
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Scott has written
Scott Alexander (Logos) | Forum Activity | Replied: Wed Oct 24, 2012 10:14 PM
Yes, the current version is very basic but we are working hard to match the functionality provided by the Logos Bible app on the iOS and Android platforms. Expect updates every few weeks.My question, why not make Windows 8 Pro work properly on a Tablet and plan that way. Better yet, make the Android version actually do something other than be a "reader" please.0 -
Joshua, I suggest you may want to move on from the Surface Pro and look at other options. While it may convince you it's worth, it's not worth spending too much time regretting and thinking about it.
The stylus is brilliant and underlines very well. I can underline with the stylus, then use my finger to swipe to another page.
I love having super-powered Logos without having to wait for a little app to be fixed. I've used Android, WindowsPhone, IOS, and simply put: no regrets on me.
The battery is easily mitigated for me because I have multiple chargers, for the office and at home. Having been in the technology and now as a pastor, I realize if I am in front of my computer for 8 hours, something's probably wrong. So the 4-5 hour battery life doesn't matter as much as having the benefit of a full powered laptop in a tablet size. (Don't forget the full HD 1080p screen.)
The volume is too low if you plan on making hospital visits and using this as a all-in-one media system. The laptop guts squished into a tablet size just doesn't allow room for room-filling sound. Physics can't be bent enough for my needs. But I can work around this issue with a simple external speaker.
The heat of the system is comparable to any laptop. It's really a brilliant cooling system. The intel i5 processer of this laptop is 100 times more powerful than a cellphone processor (or typical tablet) and thus hotter. The good news of the innovative cooling method allows this i5 to retain it's overclock longer and more consistently. So it's even faster than most ultrabooks that don't vent as efficiently.
To answer your windows laptop question, I don't know what you have. What is your Windows Laptop?
I have no need for my quad-core laptop I used to use and I don't regret no longer having an 3.8Ghz 8-core with 16GB 1600Mhz RAM, with 4 hard drives in RAID. That was a beast, but serious overkill. This reboots in seconds, about 20, but I don't count. I hope I was helpful, as writing this helps put things in perspective for me too.
A side note, have you considered getting an Android? Maybe a combination as a phone will save money too! For instance, the Samsung Galaxy Note 2 with it's stylus runs a very mature Logos app and functions like a laptop for most. Since I have to create, I chose otherwise. The stylus in the Note 2 and the Surface Windows Pro are interchangeable. In fact, I use 2 pens I had laying around from my old HP TM2 and my old Acer Tablet PC. Those devices only achieved 1.5 hrs of battery, were much slower, the GPU on the HP TX series were known to melt off the cooling system.
Yours in Christ,
Pr. Vincent Shaw +++0 -
Well said Vincent.
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Hi Vincent
Thanks for taking the time to reply. Does the underlining in a book happen automatically or do you need to open up a window and choose a highlighter color or style every time first please?
Volume is too low but I wont really be watching too many films on it anyway.
Heat is there despite every reviewer saying its negligible. I have a 2 year old Toshiba Satellite that I hooked up to a very large Samsung external screen.
I have an android motorola phone and a Nexus 7 (only 8 meg ram) which I hope to sell someday especially before the refresh comes out in July (Lord, hear my prayer). I use the Logos application on it but miss the full functionality of my laptop/large screen combo.
Glad to know the stylus works well. I would be curious for some pictures or video of the stylus working and how many steps are involved. I like to highlight in yellow as I read for example (and then - fingers crossed - see it in my windows or android version too).
Thanks again. Stay safe everyone. God bless Boston, the families of lost ones and God bless the USA - may she return to Jesus and lift Him high again!
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Joshua,
In Logos 5 on my Surface Pro, I open up the highlighting palette in the Tools menu and leave it open. Then I select the text I want to highlight with the stylus and tap the highlighting color in the palette. Done.
On an Android or iOS device, you have to select the text you want to highlight, press the highlight button that comes up when you are done selecting, select the highlighter you have previously selected (provided you have done so; if not you have to select one) and then hit the Done button.
To see a picture of what it looks like on Logos 5 on the Surface Pro, just open and leave open the highlighting palette.
I echo your benediction upon Boston. To quote a hymn, "Though the wrong seems oft so strong, God is the Ruler yet."
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[quote user="Bill Anderson"]I open up the highlighting palette in the Tools menu and leave it open
[/quote]
Bill, is it not possible to use shortcuts?
Blessings in Christ.
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[quote user="Bill Anderson"]I open up the highlighting palette in the Tools menu and leave it open
[/quote]
Bill, is it not possible to use shortcuts?
Yes, I select the text and hit "y" and it highlights in yellow. (this is when I have the Type cover attached to my Surface) When I am in tablet mode (cover flipped back) it is easier to tap on the color with the Highlighter tab open than it is to call up the onscreen keyboard and select "y").Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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Yes, I select the text and hit "y" and it highlights in yellow. (this is when I have the Type cover attached to my Surface) When I am in tablet mode (cover flipped back) it is easier to tap on the color with the Highlighter tab open than it is to call up the onscreen keyboard and select "y").I open up the highlighting palette in the Tools menu and leave it open
Bill, is it not possible to use shortcuts?
Thank you David.One more quetion, is it possible to type by both hands? How comfartable is it typing? Is it phisical? Or it is like the ipad keyboard? Is it possible to type with both hands without seeing?
Blessings in Christ.
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It touch type 95 words per minute accurate on the Type Cover, which has real mechanical keys. I use shortcuts all the time, so it works as good if not better than most keyboards. The short travel keeps it relatively quiet too.
When folded backwards, because it is a cover, it automatically shuts off the keyboard, to prevent accidental presses. But it's easy to disconnect and reconnect, just click in.
Try it in store or purchase at BestBuy where you get plenty of to know if this fits you.0 -
[quote user="Tes"]
[quote user="David Thomas"]
[quote user="Tes"]
[quote user="Bill Anderson"]I open up the highlighting palette in the Tools menu and leave it open
[/quote]
Bill, is it not possible to use shortcuts?
[/quote] Yes, I select the text and hit "y" and it highlights in yellow. (this is when I have the Type cover attached to my Surface) When I am in tablet mode (cover flipped back) it is easier to tap on the color with the Highlighter tab open than it is to call up the onscreen keyboard and select "y").[/quote]
Thank you David.One more question, is it possible to type by both hands? How comfortable is it typing? Is it physical? Or it is like the iPad keyboard? Is it possible to type by both hands without seeing?
[/quote]
I am asking more questions,because we don't have it here yet.
Blessings in Christ.
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Hi David and others.
I know how to turn on highlighting and use shortcuts on my windows laptop but hoped the tablet gave me a way to set the highlighter style and/or color with a set and forget setting? Am I dreaming?
Also, can you all weigh in on how warm the back of your Surface Pro gets after you leave it on. I hope you will be honest...its warm, huh? Warm enough you can use it as a hand warmer on cold days, right? (assuming you are not actually being radiated somehow).
I am giving serious thought to this Surface. Its a tie between this and the Samsung 700T (which scares me because of the keyboard disconnects that many report including Lisa at mobiletechreview). I also like the Hp Envy but its an atom and slower. A close third would be the Lenova Thinkpad 2.
Decisions...decisions.
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Anyone heard of this one
- Toshiba U295t
Its not out yet but apparently is supposed to be really great and really expensive.
Heavy sigh? I wonder if the Microsoft "Easy Bake" Surface will do afterall?
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Heat has not been an issue personally, but I tend to close windows that I am not using. My taskbar usually only displays these open programs - IE, Outlook, Word and Logos.
I noticed the heat of the display models at the Microsoft Store, but they were under bright lights and were running demos that show off the brilliant screen.
When I am in tablet mode (preaching, listening to a preacher in church, or websurfing on the couch) I tend not to stress the system. If I am multi-tasking or running complex searches I use the surface in laptop mode with an external mouse and the type keyboard so I am not handling the back of the Surface where the vents are located. Honestly, the fan noise on my former Dell 15z laptop was more of an irritation than the heat of the Surface.
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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Hi David and others.
I know how to turn on highlighting and use shortcuts on my windows laptop but hoped the tablet gave me a way to set the highlighter style and/or color with a set and forget setting? Am I dreaming?
Also, can you all weigh in on how warm the back of your Surface Pro gets after you leave it on. I hope you will be honest...its warm, huh? Warm enough you can use it as a hand warmer on cold days, right? (assuming you are not actually being radiated somehow).
I am giving serious thought to this Surface. Its a tie between this and the Samsung 700T (which scares me because of the keyboard disconnects that many report including Lisa at mobiletechreview). I also like the Hp Envy but its an atom and slower. A close third would be the Lenova Thinkpad 2.
Decisions...decisions.
Joshua,
As for the heat of the Surface Pro, it is warmer than I would like to be honest with you. That said, it is much, much better as far as heat goes and battery life if you modify the power settings. I turned down the brightness of the screen and scaled back the CPU and this has resulted in an acceptable level of heat for me and also better battery life.
As for your question about the tablet giving you a setting for your highlighting, remember, with the Surface Pro you are running full Logos 5 desktop. So, anything that you can set on your desktop, you can set on your tablet. Stated another way, if you can't set it on your desktop, you won't be able to set it on your tablet.
Below is a screen shot of my Surface Pro with the highlighting panel open.
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Has a note on the only sorta MS Surface Pro competitor imho.
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One more expensive and difficult to find option: The Asus Transformer Book.
http://www.asus.com/vivo/en/transformerBook.htm
It has extra storage via 500GB Hard Drive and battery (thus stabilizing weight) in the dock. The screen is bigger. Like the Yoga 13, it's physically more of a laptop than a tablet. Sadly, the price and unavailability makes this a lesser option.
On the other hand, the Surface Pro is largely available! The Surface Pro IS a laptop, in a tablet shape.
Microsoft directly is offering its $100 extended warranty with Accidental Damage protection for $100. That kinda seals the deal. They are really standing behind their design.
Regarding typing on your lap: http://pocketnow.com/2013/02/11/apple-microsoft-surface-lap-lessons
Here's a thorough review: http://pocketnow.com/2013/03/28/microsoft-surface-pro-review
Additionally, keyboards in the future may include batteries in them, via the Pro's specially designed accessory spine, that has extra powered electrical contacts. But for now, I'm glad with what I have.
I'd be glad to help you all out with more decision-making. But please consider, nothing's perfect. These are tools. We have to pull the trigger and get to work.
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Before I purchased, I saw this video review which I believe fairly mentioned many of the pros and cons of the major players. Asus was not part of this comparison, so take it for what it is worth.
After watching this I bought the 128 GB Surface Pro
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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According to the latest rumours, Microsoft's next batch of Surface tablets will include a 7-inch edition, which will go up against the Google Nexus 7 and iPad mini and which will be available before Christmas.0 -
According to the latest rumours, Microsoft's next batch of Surface tablets will include a 7-inch edition, which will go up against the Google Nexus 7 and iPad mini and which will be available before Christmas.
These will be Windows RT devices, so hopefully the Windows 8 Logos app will receive more downloads and eventually get updated someday to something more usable.0 -
I'm fairly new here... enjoying the desktop app but would really love to see a more complete experience on the Windows 8 Metro side. I use a Surface Pro as my only computer. Not having the more touch-friendly version of the app is limiting how much I can use it when I'm not at my desk.
Are there any updates on the availability of a more robust Logos app for Win8? Apologies in advance if I missed another thread, I looked around but couldn't find much recent info.
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Mr. Hill...your last post here is right on target.
I say amen....but to be fair I didnt spend the money on the Microsoft Surface because its a heavy, overpriced, oven-like, handwarmer with inadequate sound, imho.
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I just got my Surface Pro (with 256 GB HD) a few days ago. I'm still learning a lot, but I'm very pleased with it.
To be honest, the Metro App is disappointing after using the Apple App for a long time--it's functionality is extremely limited. However, I love having the full Logos experience on a Tablet.
I guess I'd like to see a continued enhancement of using touch-enabled/Windows 8 gestures on the full Logos 5 version, rather than further development of the Metro app.
Some have mentioned the heat--I haven't noticed it to be a problem, though my wife complains that my body temperature is always abnormally high. [:)] The weight, likewise, doesn't seem to be much of an issue. Battery life IS disappointing, though keep in mind that you're not running some kind of Atom processor, but a full i5 Intel chip.
As a side note, I still have my old, old Acer TravelMate C110 I got 10 years ago. I loaded Logos on that years ago, and loved that old computer. I thought the world of computing would go with such Tablets, but it took Apple's marketing and packaging to really re-awaken that market.
I can see me falling in love with this Surface Pro like I did that old Acer. And yes, I remember that the Acer's battery life was disappointing, too.
Maybe MS will develop a new type/touch cover (I use the type cover and love it) that is slightly thicker that could have a secondary battery. However, as the type cover is usually used in a more desktop-ish environment (where power access may be less of an issue), it may not add that much functionality.
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The Surface RT turned out to be a gateway drug for me. I traded up to a full Surface Pro (though a 128 unlike your 256, Daniel). It's the first full Windows computer I've bought since 1997.
I agree that the only downside is the battery life. The Pro only lasts half as long as the RT, but will do twice as much. Nevertheless, it seems to me that the the metro version of apps are still valuable on the Pro because they seem to be much less intensive on the processor and thus don't drain the battery as quickly. It makes sense for companies such as Logos to continue to develop these apps while perhaps making their core product more touch-friendly at the same time.
A metro app doesn't have to be as powerful as the regular one, but if it will do most things in a pinch, it can be used in place of the full app in most situations with the freedom to use the full app if necessary.
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Surface Pro Prices just dropped - http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57596910-75/microsoft-cuts-surface-pro-tablet-prices-by-$100/
In my opinion this is the best single piece of hardware to run Logos5.
L5 for Win still outperforms L5 for Apple (although parity is getting closer)
Surface Pro's tablet form allows me to use it for preaching, but when in my study I can connect to mouse and external monitor and do complex searches with the full L5 feature set.
Making Disciples! Logos Ecosystem = LogosMax on Microsoft Surface Pro 7 (Win11), Android app on tablet, FSB on iPhone & iPad mini, Proclaim (Proclaim Remote on Fire Tablet).
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L5 for Win still outperforms L5 for Apple (although parity is getting closer)
David, I echo your praise for the Surface Pro. It's a very underrated machine--and the first full Windows machine I have bought since 1997 (unless you count the Acer Netbook I bought a few years ago to make into a Hackintosh). I especially love the stylus, which is a much better experience on the Pro than trying to use a mushy capacitive stylus on an iPad.
However, in regard to speed, L5 starts up much slower on my Surface Pro than it does on my MacBook Pro (although both of them take longer than they should this far into development IMO). And on my Surface Pro, sometimes startup gets hung while (I guess) trying to connect to Logos' servers, before the main window ever comes up. If it never connects it will just keep trying, and I have to force it to quit. After that, it won't even start up again at all unless I reboot the entire computer. This may be a Windows thing--I don't know--but I don't have that problem on my Mac.
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R. Mansfield....David Thomas almost had me a believer again but your honest assessment of the overpriced, overrated, overheated, one-should-really-wait-for-a-refresh or want to be a weight-lifter, before purchasing this machine - has given me pause. It probably makes an excellent hand-warmer in your cold office in the middle of winter too. This hardware is a hot brick imho.
The MS Surface Pro is a Turkey - a dud - a fizzle - a raspberry - a lame duck - a.....well you get the picture. $100 off for this dud still isn't enough! God bless everyone who bought this or the ATIV with the constant wifi disconnects.
Joshua (who sighs and returns to his corner again)
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